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Old 01-18-2020, 08:37 PM   #36
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WTF is this all about?

No combative posting upstairs. You've gone off the rails. Relax.
I am not going to reply to a condescending troll like Hipower. If he would have asked respectfully like a normal person, I would have gladly answered his questions.
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Old 01-18-2020, 09:51 PM   #37
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I am not going to reply to a condescending troll like Hipower. If he would have asked respectfully like a normal person, I would have gladly answered his questions.
Love how the words troll and condescending are coming from a person with your two posts in this thread. One nonsensical post and one childish one. Oh, and you did answer my question, whether you know it or not.
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Old 01-19-2020, 08:31 AM   #38
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Your opinion is noted and subsequently discarded, but you're entitled to it BHP.... The paint is crappy I agree on that part although that's not the crux of the biscuit.
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Old 01-19-2020, 10:13 AM   #39
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It seems once any AK is banned or discontinued they shoot up in price. Why is this not true they haven’t been imported in almost 30yrs true commie build though neutered way closer to a AK than and saiga sporter. But the mac90 still gets the same price as a wasr and other entry level aks.
As has been mentioned already, the reason they have lower value is because there are a lot of them.

The Chinese rifles by themselves are partially responsible for the original assault weapons ban because I mean, very large quantities were coming in and then when it was discovered that full auto rifles were coming in as well, they shut them down along with everything else.
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Old 01-19-2020, 10:59 AM   #40
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Because mak90s are bottom of the barrel AKs, comparable to yugos.
I disagree and I'll tell you why. Stamped receiver yugo AK's have thick RPK receivers (60% thicker steel than standard AK receivers), they have bulged RPK front trunnions (much less prone to cracking), and a real AK-47 profile barrel (standard stamped receiver AK's have a thinner AKM profile barrel). Nobody is going to convince me that an AK with a receiver made of thinner steel, with a weaker front trunnion, and with a thinner barrel is better than one with an RPK receiver and front trunnion and a thicker barrel. Vepr's have thick RPK receivers, bulged front trunnions, and heavy barrels and people rave about them for those reasons so I don't see why a yugo AK should be looked at any different. If you're going to say that a vepr is great for those reasons then you also have to give the same praise to the yugos because they have the same stuff. I've just given real and solid reasons why I think yugos are better than most other AK's, it is not based on some sort of baseless emotional attachment to them. I don't think that a pretty finish or a smoother trigger makes a "light duty" AKM better than a heavy duty yugo (or vepr) AK-47, nope, not at all. And that goes for all countries AK's, not just Chinese AK's. There is nothing about a "made in China" AK that makes me want to pay the premium for one. Chinese AK's used to be the cheapest AK's on the market and the only reason why they cost a lot now is because of the import ban. If the ban ever gets lifted China will flood the market with them again and they will go back to being the cheapest AK's on the market and you know that it's true.
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Old 01-19-2020, 11:06 AM   #41
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I disagree and I'll tell you why. Stamped receiver yugo AK's have thick RPK receivers (60% thicker steel than standard AK receivers), they have bulged RPK front trunnions (much less prone to cracking), and a real AK-47 profile barrel (standard stamped receiver AK's have a thinner AKM profile barrel). Nobody is going to convince me that an AK with a receiver made of thinner steel, with a weaker front trunnion, and with a thinner barrel is better than one with an RPK receiver and front trunnion and a thicker barrel. Vepr's have thick RPK receivers, bulged front trunnions, and heavy barrels and people rave about them for those reasons so I don't see why a yugo AK should be looked at any different. If you're going to say that a vepr is great for those reasons then you also have to give the same praise to the yugos because they have the same stuff. I've just given real and solid reasons why I think yugos are better than most other AK's, it is not based on some sort of baseless emotional attachment to them. I don't think that a pretty finish or a smoother trigger makes a "light duty" AKM better than a heavy duty yugo (or vepr) AK-47, nope, not at all. And that goes for all countries AK's, not just Chinese AK's. There is nothing about a "made in China" AK that makes me want to pay the premium for one. Chinese AK's used to be the cheapest AK's on the market and the only reason why they cost a lot now is because of the import ban. If the ban ever gets lifted China will flood the market with them again and they will go back to being the cheapest AK's on the market and you know that it's true.
Chinese AKs also have the thicker barrel. And chrome lining, and a pretty finish.
On the SKS side of things, I have never seen a Chinese SKS with a shot out barrel, but Yugo SKS are about 70/30.
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Old 01-19-2020, 12:29 PM   #42
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Chinese AKs also have the thicker barrel. And chrome lining, and a pretty finish.
On the SKS side of things, I have never seen a Chinese SKS with a shot out barrel, but Yugo SKS are about 70/30.
Yeah but "made in China" AK's don't have the heavy duty RPK receiver and heavy duty RPK front trunnion so your beloved "made in China" AK is still a light duty AK. Oh and as for never seeing a Chinese SKS with a shot out barrel, it's because the ones that got imported here weren't used in a war like the yugo guns were so nice try at knocking the yugo SKS. As for the chrome lining, can you afford the amount of ammo it will take to wear out a non chrome lined barrel? How many tens of thousands of rounds will it take to wear it out? Oh and non chrome lined barrels are more accurate than chrome lined ones so it's a trade off, longer wear or better accuracy, which one do you want. Like I said, nobody is going to convince me that a light duty AKM from ANY country is better than a heavy duty yugo.

Last edited by TheGreek!; 01-19-2020 at 12:42 PM.
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Old 01-19-2020, 12:55 PM   #43
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They’re certainly not, that much is clear. Bottom of the barrel (given online reports of build and machining quality) are the Maadis.

However, people also make the mistake of becoming enchanted with their Chinese AKs because they’re beautiful rifles and because they’re heavy. Then they become the “best” for no reason other than the emotional connection of the owner.

There is no “best” when it comes to a properly built AK. They all have similar accuracy and all run reliably. “Best” could correlate to most consistent QC when it comes to AKs, not, “Oh wow my AK looks and feels so cool, so the Chinese make the best AKs!”
A very interesting point. I agree that there is no single “ est,” nor “worst,” yet I have observed different levels of consistency in machining and functionality.

My experience with MAK90s - none owned - just handled and shot others - was that all were well made and functioned flawlessly.

The only slam fires I have ever experienced were with Yugos.
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Old 01-19-2020, 01:24 PM   #44
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A very interesting point. I agree that there is no single “ est,” nor “worst,” yet I have observed different levels of consistency in machining and functionality.

My experience with MAK90s - none owned - just handled and shot others - was that all were well made and functioned flawlessly.

The only slam fires I have ever experienced were with Yugos.
I have 30 (yes, 30) yugo AK's and all of them function flawlessly, none of them have ever slam fired. Did you bother to try to find out what caused it? Chances are there was some cosmline or some other crap in the bolt that kept the firing pin from moving freely in it. That's not the fault of the gun, that's the fault of the operator of it not cleaning the gun properly.
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Old 01-19-2020, 01:30 PM   #45
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I disagree and I'll tell you why. Stamped receiver yugo AK's have thick RPK receivers (60% thicker steel than standard AK receivers), they have bulged RPK front trunnions (much less prone to cracking), and a real AK-47 profile barrel (standard stamped receiver AK's have a thinner AKM profile barrel). Nobody is going to convince me that an AK with a receiver made of thinner steel, with a weaker front trunnion, and with a thinner barrel is better than one with an RPK receiver and front trunnion and a thicker barrel. Vepr's have thick RPK receivers, bulged front trunnions, and heavy barrels and people rave about them for those reasons so I don't see why a yugo AK should be looked at any different. If you're going to say that a vepr is great for those reasons then you also have to give the same praise to the yugos because they have the same stuff. I've just given real and solid reasons why I think yugos are better than most other AK's, it is not based on some sort of baseless emotional attachment to them. I don't think that a pretty finish or a smoother trigger makes a "light duty" AKM better than a heavy duty yugo (or vepr) AK-47, nope, not at all. And that goes for all countries AK's, not just Chinese AK's. There is nothing about a "made in China" AK that makes me want to pay the premium for one. Chinese AK's used to be the cheapest AK's on the market and the only reason why they cost a lot now is because of the import ban. If the ban ever gets lifted China will flood the market with them again and they will go back to being the cheapest AK's on the market and you know that it's true.
I'm not here to knock any import AK, but there are very clear distinctions, or categories of import AKs, and at least in my experience, yugos and chinese are bottom of the barrel imports.

That doesn't mean they aren't functional, or that they didn't get anything right, just that there are far better options out there imo.

I never understood the appeal of RPK features like the thicker bulged reciever, trunion, and heavy barrel outside of an actual RPK clone. I know you have many RPKs, and for that purpose it makes perfect sense. Whether it's a yugo, or a vepr, or anything else in the 16" semi auto category, those RPK features are useless.

While a chrome lined barrel isn't a priority to you, it is to me.

Lastly yugos, chinese, and hungarians deviated from the soviet design too much for my liking. Their rifles look close enough to soviet AKs, and the function just like them, but they share almost no parts compatibility. If all you have, and all you ever plan to have is yugos then that point is moot. My preference has always been towards soviet spec rifles. Russian, bulgarian, polish, and east german AKs are what I consider top shelf AKs. Yugo, chinese, and hungarians have always been bottom tier, imo. Everything else is somewhere in between.

Speaking specifically towards chinese AKs, I've owned and shot enough of them to see them fail quite catastrophically. It's why I can't ever recommend a Chinese AK to anyone, ever, for any reason.

Ymmv.
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Old 01-19-2020, 02:03 PM   #46
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I'm not here to knock any import AK, but there are very clear distinctions, or categories of import AKs, and at least in my experience, yugos and chinese are bottom of the barrel imports.

That doesn't mean they aren't functional, or that they didn't get anything right, just that there are far better options out there imo.

I never understood the appeal of RPK features like the thicker bulged reciever, trunion, and heavy barrel outside of an actual RPK clone. I know you have many RPKs, and for that purpose it makes perfect sense. Whether it's a yugo, or a vepr, or anything else in the 16" semi auto category, those RPK features are useless.

While a chrome lined barrel isn't a priority to you, it is to me.

Lastly yugos, chinese, and hungarians deviated from the soviet design too much for my liking. Their rifles look close enough to soviet AKs, and the function just like them, but they share almost no parts compatibility. If all you have, and all you ever plan to have is yugos then that point is moot. My preference has always been towards soviet spec rifles. Russian, bulgarian, polish, and east german AKs are what I consider top shelf AKs. Yugo, chinese, and hungarians have always been bottom tier, imo. Everything else is somewhere in between.

Speaking specifically towards chinese AKs, I've owned and shot enough of them to see them fail quite catastrophically. It's why I can't ever recommend a Chinese AK to anyone, ever, for any reason.

Ymmv.
Please go into detail as to WHY you think yugos AK's are bottom of the barrel. Do they break parts like Chinese AK's? Not that I've heard of. Is it because they don't take "standard" AK furniture? That's a non issue to me because I don't plan on putting other countries furniture on them. Is it because the barrels aren't chrome lined? Again, there's good and bad to both kinds of barrels, a chrome lined barrel will last longer but a non chrome lined barrel is more accurate. Yugos have a hot blued finish unlike Russian, Bulgarian, and Egyptian AK's that have a cheap painted finish so you can't say that the finish on them is bottom of the barrel. Their parts aren't roughly machined like you'll see on an Egyptian or Romanian AK so you can't say that the machining on them is the bottom of the barrel so I'll ask once again, why do you think they are the bottom of the barrel when they are clearly better than some other countries AK's, please go into detail as to why.
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Old 01-19-2020, 03:16 PM   #47
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Your opinion is noted and subsequently discarded, but you're entitled to it BHP.... The paint is crappy I agree on that part although that's not the crux of the biscuit.
Aren’t they blued? And it’s not like I’m saying I’m a 100% correct and you’re all wrong no matter what. That’s was my opinion based on me seeing nothing that can make one durable, reliable, well built, and ~2 MOA AK “better” than another one with the exact same characteristics. I have Vepr FMs, SAM7s, among others, and they are no better than my 2015 WASR. All of them are straight, built well, have similar accuracy, and haven’t malfunctioned.

Discard my opinion, assert I’m wrong, tell me I don’t know what I’m talking about, I don’t care and may agree if you make a good point. I was skeptical of what the dude was saying and he decided to go with a childish insult as a response. Condescension was his response, not my initial doubt on a Chinese AK being the absolute best out there.
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Old 01-20-2020, 09:00 AM   #48
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Sorry was thinking of something else on the paint there. No don't think they're the best, but damned good and not BOB.
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Old 02-18-2020, 07:24 AM   #49
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Love the look of the blue on Chinese AKs but some of them rust just looking at them. Yes even when kept oiled in my experience. Not all but some. There always the first to go if cash is needed to fund other endeavors. Just my opinion lol
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Old 02-18-2020, 02:48 PM   #50
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I used to won both Norinco and Polytech AK's They were very reliable, but their accuracy was not the best. Bought a Maadi imported by PARS and it was both reliable and very accurate. Sold my Chinese AK's and bought Romanian SAR1 and Hungarian FEG SA85 which were also reliable and very accurate. Do not miss the Chinese AK's.
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Old 02-19-2020, 09:56 AM   #51
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"Love the one you're with".

Generally the basis of which is the best of any category.
Vehicle, firearm, tool etc.
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Old 06-29-2020, 01:40 AM   #52
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I own a few MAK90 variants...slant, square, etc. they’re serviceable rifles of consistent quality. I also own a Polytech AKS side folder...better finish, nicer weapon. The AK hobbyist could enjoy years of fun with the MAK.
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Old 06-29-2020, 08:00 AM   #53
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I love MAK90 converted.
Smooth action and great trigger right off.
The trade off was finding the spiker and correct furniture for it. Once done... it is awesome.

It doesn't get much shooting time compare to my 5.45....
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Old 06-29-2020, 11:12 AM   #54
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The MAK90 is quite popular and sought after.
There is a limited number and no imports.
Over time the price has escalated.

Prices in the $750-$850 for square back examples and a bit less for slant cut..

Conversion to a milspec clone could add $150- $350 on top of the cost.

With the price of WASR and PAP rifles now settling in the $725- $850 and higher range.
Not sure where that puts the MAK prices now.
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Old 06-29-2020, 11:29 AM   #55
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The MAK90 is quite popular and sought after.
There is a limited number and no imports.
Over time the price has escalated.

Prices in the $750-$850 for square back examples and a bit less for slant cut..

Conversion to a milspec clone could add $150- $350 on top of the cost.

With the price of WASR and PAP rifles now settling in the $725- $850 and higher range.
Not sure where that puts the MAK prices now.
I've been following MAK's pretty closely the past few months. I sold my square back MAK with proper 56S stock and pistol grip for $1k back in March. I got what I had in the rifle back out of it so I was happy. I've followed a few lately and most unconverted have been selling for right at $1k with the highest unconverted being $1300!!! I was shocked on that one when it sold at auction. Made zero sense to me because that's almost what I paid for a mint 56S last year. That's panic buying for you...
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Old 06-29-2020, 11:46 AM   #56
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The only reason people want tbe Chinese rifles is because they cant have them now.

If they were still imported by the thousands and politics and and laws and panic were not a factor there would be very little demand for them .

There nothing special and some were pretty crappy .

Just like a Saiga is nothing special untill they were sanctioned then suddenly there the best mother Rissia thing since toilet paper .

You could barely give them away in the early days.
There quality never got better because they got banned .
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Old 06-29-2020, 11:57 AM   #57
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There quality never got better because they got banned .
True.....but.....

There wasn't as much to compare them to back then. Now we have Century's druken monkey USA made gems and IO's IED's.

MAK-90's certainly climbed a few rungs up the ladder now that we have much worse offerings.
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Old 06-29-2020, 01:22 PM   #58
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Sure, but that doesn't make them better rifles. Then again, in this case I'm with The Greek - I'm perfectly happy with Yugos.
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Old 06-29-2020, 01:29 PM   #59
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People buy what they want. Could be based on price, appearance, name, country of origin, features etc., etc.
If an AK shoots when the trigger is pulled and the projectile strikes somewhere near the point of aim. All good.
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Old 06-29-2020, 01:36 PM   #60
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Sure, but that doesn't make them better rifles. Then again, in this case I'm with The Greek - I'm perfectly happy with Yugos.
Don't get me wrong, I wasn't saying there's anything wrong with a Yugo. I have several Yugo's, I'm quite fond of them. There are a few places where the MAK kinda outshines the Yugo (Namely chrome lined barrel and a good trigger) but thats about it.

Besides a Mitchell, the only Yugo's you could get back then were kit builds, often with sewer pipe barrels.

The new Yugo imports look pretty nice though.
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Old 06-29-2020, 01:44 PM   #61
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Just bought a milled 386 mak90 (after a 3 year search for something specific) Guys still dont understand what these are I guess.... what's better than a converted milled mak spiker? An m70? A stamped arsenal? A PSA AKE?

Milled guns are the best AK47s and if you dont own any you wouldnt know.
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Old 06-29-2020, 01:50 PM   #62
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I own both stamped and milled. Built both types as well. They are different vs one better than the other. Weight, features, furniture, optics etc., choices are all factors in how one uses the rifle etc.
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Old 06-29-2020, 02:09 PM   #63
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I dont mind weight. I like solid overbuilt stuff that will last when it comes to tools. That's one of the reasons I like yugos aswell, same reasons Greek stated.
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Old 06-29-2020, 02:29 PM   #64
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Each to their own.
"Better" is subjective.
Some prefer light vs heavy.
Obviously that is the trend in milspec firearms in use by the military today.

Buy and use what you like.
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Old 06-29-2020, 02:56 PM   #65
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A milled Chinese is definitely quality. The only milled rifle that I have experience with that's better or smoother is the Arsenal SAM5. I have yet to feel anything nicer. I would take a milled MAK over stamped everyday of the week. It sucks that word got out several years ago that they're actually good rifles and not Chinese junk like everyone thought they were. All the ones I've owned or handled were all straight and didn't have the issues that many are having today. YMMV
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Old 06-30-2020, 02:14 AM   #66
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EIther you haven’t owned any or you are short closed minded.
All my mak 90 have been better guns than my wasr or Yugos.
Russian might edge them out a bit, and Bulgarian remain supreme
Comparing a MAK90 to a PAP isn't what I would consider a fair fight. MAKs were the tail end of the glory days, same as the Mitchell M90. A preban Yugo is head and shoulders above a preban 56s in terms of fit and finish. I'd rather have a MAK than a PAP too.
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Old 06-30-2020, 02:38 AM   #67
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Nicest finish on any AK that I've ever handled.

Nothing else has the deep blue finish. Everything else is just painted.
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Old 06-30-2020, 03:27 AM   #68
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Originally Posted by hoovdizzle View Post
i guess i never really thought about a Mak not being much more than a Wasr. good point.
The mak-90's are *still* steels in my opinion.
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Old 06-30-2020, 06:34 AM   #69
jdg
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I love my bob MAK90! It def has the best trigger of any AK I have ever pulled. I don't care about hanging a bayonet, or cleaning rod on it, so i'm leaving it as it is.

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Old 06-30-2020, 07:45 AM   #70
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Why is this thread in this sub-forum? Admins?
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