Go Back   The AK Files Forums > General Forums > RKBA and Legal

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 03-21-2004, 08:20 PM   #1
Packrat
Veteran Member
 
AKaholic #: 8
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Mt Vernon IL
Posts: 1,059
Default BATFE list of parts on semi-automatic rifles

Here's the official list of rifle parts (from Title 27--ALCOHOL, TOBACCO PRODUCTS AND FIREARMS

Sec. 478.39 Assembly of semiautomatic rifles or shotguns., paragraph c:
*(1) Frames, receivers, receiver castings, forgings or stampings
*(2) Barrels
(3) Barrel extensions
*(4) Mounting blocks (trunions) (receiver and trunion are 1 piece if milled)
#(5) Muzzle attachments
*(6) Bolts
*(7) Bolt carriers
(8) Operating rods
*(9) Gas pistons
(10) Trigger housings
*(11) Triggers
*(12) Hammers
(13) Sears (in the AK, the trigger and sear are 1 piece)
*(14) Disconnectors
*(15) Buttstocks
#(16) Pistol grips
*(17) Forearms, handguards
*(18) Magazine bodies
*(19) Followers
*(20) Floorplates
The AK has only those parts marked with * or maybe #. That's 14 parts without pistol grip or "muzzle device". You can have 10 of them and still consider the rifle "not imported". If you supply a US-made receiver, that's a US part. US buttstock, forearm, and pistol grip are 3 parts, but the pistol grip would be replacing a # part; we're counting down from 15 in this case. In the same way, a US muzzle brake would be a null part; if you count it as a replacement, you have to start at 16 parts. This is why it is easier to count the import parts.
__________________
Packrat
The Avtomat Kalashnikov--the choice of freedom-fighters everywhere
Packrat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2006, 04:10 PM   #2
seniormech49
New Member
 
AKaholic #: 6210
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 4
Default compliance parts

I'm new to this forum and the idea of building/modifying a foreign military rifle. My question - if I purchase a "stock" unmodified SKS can I put a TAPCO T6 stock on it and still not incur the wrath of the federales?
Or will I have to go ahead and build it per 922r?
Thanks in advance.
seniormech49 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2006, 11:08 PM   #3
LESchwartz
Veteran Member
Contributor
 
LESchwartz's Avatar
 
AKaholic #: 2434
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Sunny Minnesota
Posts: 1,225
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by seniormech49
I'm new to this forum and the idea of building/modifying a foreign military rifle. My question - if I purchase a "stock" unmodified SKS can I put a TAPCO T6 stock on it and still not incur the wrath of the federales?
Or will I have to go ahead and build it per 922r?
Thanks in advance.
Absolutely, positively it's a 922(r) violation! And even though ATF doesn't appear to be enforcing 922(r), the law is the law -- and one violates it at their own risk.

Larry

PS: For more information, see my FAQ: http://www.victorinc.com/SKS-FAQ.html
__________________
For more info see my SKS FAQ: http://www.victorinc.com/SKS-FAQ.html
LESchwartz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2006, 10:03 AM   #4
seniormech49
New Member
 
AKaholic #: 6210
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 4
Default

OK - thanks again. I'll start shopping for the extras.
Better safe than sorry.
seniormech49 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2006, 10:34 AM   #5
seniormech49
New Member
 
AKaholic #: 6210
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 4
Default

TAPCO has an SKS compliance combo #ZSKS66166B for $99.99 that has a total of 9 compliance parts. Any suggestions for the 10th compliance part?
seniormech49 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2006, 11:16 AM   #6
LESchwartz
Veteran Member
Contributor
 
LESchwartz's Avatar
 
AKaholic #: 2434
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Sunny Minnesota
Posts: 1,225
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by seniormech49
TAPCO has an SKS compliance combo #ZSKS66166B for $99.99 that has a total of 9 compliance parts. Any suggestions for the 10th compliance part?
A Yugo SKS w/ pistol grip has 16 parts -- 14 parts on the standard SKS + GL + Pistol Grip = 16. The original tapco kit included a stock & handguard (2), gas piston (1), op-rod (0), and magazine (2) -- for a total of 5 replacment parts, which leaves you with "10 or less" . . . 15 - 5 = 10.

Larry

EDITED TO REFLECT THE CURRENT INFORMATION FROM ATF IS THAT THE SKS ONLY HAS 14 IMPORTED PARTS. YUGO SKS'S HAVE 15. I RECEIVED THIS INFO AFTER THIS WAS POSTED.
__________________
For more info see my SKS FAQ: http://www.victorinc.com/SKS-FAQ.html

Last edited by LESchwartz; 07-14-2007 at 08:24 PM.
LESchwartz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2006, 02:58 PM   #7
seniormech49
New Member
 
AKaholic #: 6210
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 4
Default

Again - thanks
seniormech49 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2007, 05:16 PM   #8
panzertruppe
Curio & Relic
 
AKaholic #: 3934
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 8,021
Default

woops, wrong thread
panzertruppe is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2007, 08:54 PM   #9
Fal_fiend
Member
 
AKaholic #: 7380
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 35
Default

so if u build a stamped recieverd AK, u would need 6 parts if u use a muzzle brake ?
Fal_fiend is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2007, 09:59 PM   #10
KernelKrink
Curio & Relic
 
KernelKrink's Avatar
 
AKaholic #: 2036
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 9,268
Default

Yes.
KernelKrink is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2007, 04:06 PM   #11
olereb1
Member
 
AKaholic #: 8457
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 29
Default

I have a milled MAK90. IF I replace the thumbhole stock with an Ironwood 3 piece stock = 3 parts but can't count but 2, then use all new USA made POS mags= 3 parts then I would be ok with 5 countable parts?
olereb1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2007, 04:49 PM   #12
LESchwartz
Veteran Member
Contributor
 
LESchwartz's Avatar
 
AKaholic #: 2434
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Sunny Minnesota
Posts: 1,225
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by olereb1
I have a milled MAK90. IF I replace the thumbhole stock with an Ironwood 3 piece stock = 3 parts but can't count but 2, then use all new USA made POS mags= 3 parts then I would be ok with 5 countable parts?
If you have a threaded muzzle: 15 - 6 = 9, and you should be good.

If you don't have a threaded muzzle then it's: 14 - 6 = 8, and you should be good.

Don't know why you think you can only count the Ironwood set (stock, pg, and handguard) as two parts . . . but if you're thinking that it only subtracts two imported parts, then the math is: 14 - 5 = 9 and 13 - 5 = 8 respectively . . . but you still end up with the same end result.

In any of the above cases, I would stay away from "POS mags" . . . use should be able to use imported mag bodies . . . or better yet, find swap some other parts and use imported mags.

Larry

PS: Edited to reflect that I missed the "milled receiver" in the above post.
__________________
For more info see my SKS FAQ: http://www.victorinc.com/SKS-FAQ.html

Last edited by LESchwartz; 06-30-2007 at 08:29 PM.
LESchwartz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2007, 07:42 PM   #13
KernelKrink
Curio & Relic
 
KernelKrink's Avatar
 
AKaholic #: 2036
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 9,268
Default

Larry, he has a MILLED MAK90, only the stamped receivers use a separate trunnion so he is starting with one less part anyway.

Olereb1, what you need to do is look at the configuration you will wind up with once the parts are replaced. In that case the rifle with mag in place would have 15 countable parts with a muzzle device, or 14 without. The ironwood 3 piece furniture set would remove 3 from the imported parts count. That leaves either 11 or 12 imported parts out of an allowed 10. So you need to replace at least 1 and possibly 2 parts to be legal. A US mag would definitely do that but as Larry mentioned they are not known for reliabilty. If you just need the one part I would recommend getting a gas piston, they are easy to install and are hidden when installed. An imported mag using US made floorplates is also an option, the floorplate wouldn't make a difference on reliability.
KernelKrink is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2007, 08:27 PM   #14
LESchwartz
Veteran Member
Contributor
 
LESchwartz's Avatar
 
AKaholic #: 2434
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Sunny Minnesota
Posts: 1,225
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by KernelKrink
Larry, he has a MILLED MAK90, only the stamped receivers use a separate trunnion so he is starting with one less part anyway.
I edited my original post to reflect that I missed the MILLED part of his post.

Larry

PS: Note to self -- Read twice, post once . . .
__________________
For more info see my SKS FAQ: http://www.victorinc.com/SKS-FAQ.html
LESchwartz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2007, 09:19 PM   #15
medic1
Member
 
AKaholic #: 6710
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 66
Default

"The ironwood 3 piece furniture set would remove 3 from the imported parts count."

Correct me if I'm wrong;but, I believe the upper and lower HG are considered one part and PG as one. =2 parts.
medic1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2007, 09:41 PM   #16
motorhead
EVIL GENIUS
 
motorhead's Avatar
 
AKaholic #: 6093
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: peoples republik of kalifornia
Posts: 16,768
Default

i believe that is correct. i also believe that only one need be us.(handguards that is) mags count as 3, if only there was one that worked.
motorhead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2007, 09:55 PM   #17
medic1
Member
 
AKaholic #: 6710
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 66
Default

You are so true, US mags suck!! I just replace the follower and floorplates=2 parts. Can't wait till grasshopper comes out with some 7,62 floorplates.
medic1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2007, 10:18 PM   #18
LESchwartz
Veteran Member
Contributor
 
LESchwartz's Avatar
 
AKaholic #: 2434
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Sunny Minnesota
Posts: 1,225
Default

Actually, I think that both need to be US-made for the entire handguard to qualify as US-made.

The more I think about it, the more confused I am . . . Ironwood sells 4-piece sets, which remove 3 imported parts . . .

Larry
__________________
For more info see my SKS FAQ: http://www.victorinc.com/SKS-FAQ.html
LESchwartz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-30-2007, 10:23 PM   #19
medic1
Member
 
AKaholic #: 6710
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 66
Default

Yes, truly confusing!!! I do believe upper and lower must be US to count as one part; but then again, if they want to bust your ass they will change it and make it so
medic1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-2007, 11:50 PM   #20
olereb1
Member
 
AKaholic #: 8457
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 29
Default

Thanks folks! That info helped a lot. This stuff gets to be confusing to say the least. I appreciate you advice. I guess I could under take replacing my FCG with a G2 Double hook Tapco but the original trigger is so smooth.
olereb1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2007, 02:49 AM   #21
John@JCDLESales
Veteran Member
 
John@JCDLESales's Avatar
 
AKaholic #: 1595
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: White Oak, PA
Posts: 1,601
Default

Here this will cornfuse ya a bit more:

Note also that section 922(r) only bans "assembly", it is not
a crime to possess a weapon "assembled" in violation of this
section. However it may be subject to seizure and forfeiture, under
some circumstances, if ATF can show it was assembled in knowing or
willful violation of the Gun Control Act, under 18 U.S.C. section
924(d)(1), by clear and convincing evidence.

So if you posted to this thread then you knew unfortunatly and that would be all the evidence they would need.
__________________
John McCaw
FFL/SOT2

JCD Tactical Law Enforcement Sales
White Oak, PA 15131-2104
(412) 980-1233
John@JCDLESales is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2007, 08:19 AM   #22
LESchwartz
Veteran Member
Contributor
 
LESchwartz's Avatar
 
AKaholic #: 2434
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Sunny Minnesota
Posts: 1,225
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by John@JCDLESales
Here this will cornfuse ya a bit more:
So if you posted to this thread then you knew unfortunatly and that would be all the evidence they would need.
LOL . . .

I'm always surprised that we don't hear "I have this friend..." in these threads.

Larry
__________________
For more info see my SKS FAQ: http://www.victorinc.com/SKS-FAQ.html
LESchwartz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2007, 09:45 AM   #23
KernelKrink
Curio & Relic
 
KernelKrink's Avatar
 
AKaholic #: 2036
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 9,268
Default

Back when I was Gunsmithin' it was always the "Brother in Law". Yeah, my Brother in Law took this gun completely apart and now I can't get it back together.....
KernelKrink is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2007, 02:33 PM   #24
shotswapper
Member
 
AKaholic #: 7332
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 209
Default

I think I may be confused here. I went to the sks site above, and it stated that they have 14 countable parts. So, if I add a US made folding stock(replacing the original stock and handguard) and a US made mag(replacing the original mag body and follower) am I not at 10 or less parts?
shotswapper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2007, 08:15 PM   #25
LESchwartz
Veteran Member
Contributor
 
LESchwartz's Avatar
 
AKaholic #: 2434
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Sunny Minnesota
Posts: 1,225
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by shotswapper
I think I may be confused here. I went to the sks site above, and it stated that they have 14 countable parts. So, if I add a US made folding stock(replacing the original stock and handguard) and a US made mag(replacing the original mag body and follower) am I not at 10 or less parts?
I maintain the SKS site noted above. You are correct. Note that ATF finally (after 4 letters and 5 years) answered my straightforward question on how many 922(r) parts are in an SKS. We had been imagining that there could be as many as 17 parts (18 on a Yugo).

On the typical (non-Yugo) SKS a US-made stock and handguard replace two parts, a US-made mag replace two more, so . . . 14 - 4 = 10.

Larry
__________________
For more info see my SKS FAQ: http://www.victorinc.com/SKS-FAQ.html
LESchwartz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-17-2008, 12:43 PM   #26
Thunderbred
Member
 
AKaholic #: 2221
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 130
Default

If you want to install a folding bayonet on a MAK, does it count as a barrel extension or what? Anyone with experience on this. Thanks, Jeff
Thunderbred is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2008, 01:05 AM   #27
Joey2tone
Senior Member
 
Joey2tone's Avatar
 
AKaholic #: 7580
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Midwest
Posts: 645
Default

Here's another ?. I was lead to believe that the Yugo SKS; purchased as a C&R, could not be changed in any way possible. To change the configuration of a C&R; no less Yugo SKS, would delete the C&R status and render said rifle as non-importable and illegal........ no matter how many 922r parts are on it. What say you all? I won't pay an exuberant price if I can modify to my content!!!
__________________
An AK is like a classic Chevy, most parts fit but a few are special.

Big Sky, Ft. Benning, & Gus Grissom AFB!

When you're right, you're wrong; when you're wrong, you're fawked!"
Joey2tone is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2008, 07:44 PM   #28
LESchwartz
Veteran Member
Contributor
 
LESchwartz's Avatar
 
AKaholic #: 2434
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Sunny Minnesota
Posts: 1,225
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thunderbred
If you want to install a folding bayonet on a MAK, does it count as a barrel extension or what? Anyone with experience on this. Thanks, Jeff
I don't believe so.

Larry
__________________
For more info see my SKS FAQ: http://www.victorinc.com/SKS-FAQ.html
LESchwartz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2008, 07:56 PM   #29
John@JCDLESales
Veteran Member
 
John@JCDLESales's Avatar
 
AKaholic #: 1595
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: White Oak, PA
Posts: 1,601
Default

I belive it would have to Extend From The Barrel not be added to it.
__________________
John McCaw
FFL/SOT2

JCD Tactical Law Enforcement Sales
White Oak, PA 15131-2104
(412) 980-1233
John@JCDLESales is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2008, 07:57 PM   #30
LESchwartz
Veteran Member
Contributor
 
LESchwartz's Avatar
 
AKaholic #: 2434
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Sunny Minnesota
Posts: 1,225
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joey2tone
Here's another ?. I was lead to believe that the Yugo SKS; purchased as a C&R, could not be changed in any way possible. To change the configuration of a C&R; no less Yugo SKS, would delete the C&R status and render said rifle as non-importable and illegal........ no matter how many 922r parts are on it. What say you all? I won't pay an exuberant price if I can modify to my content!!!
The rule is: "If you modify the rifle such that it loses C&R status, you may have to do the 922(r) parts swap thing." However, it depends on the restricted features that remain after the mods. If there are no restricted features left, then the mod is legal. Otherwise, you need to replace imported parts with 922(r) compliant parts.

Larry
__________________
For more info see my SKS FAQ: http://www.victorinc.com/SKS-FAQ.html
LESchwartz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-2008, 10:13 PM   #31
Thunderbred
Member
 
AKaholic #: 2221
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 130
Default

So where do bayos and thier lugs fall now? Jeff
Thunderbred is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-02-2008, 04:37 PM   #32
VALMET_M76
Temp ban-Multiple indiscretions.
 
VALMET_M76's Avatar
 
AKaholic #: 90
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 3,655
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thunderbred
So where do bayos and thier lugs fall now? Jeff
That was the Assault Weapons Ban, now sunsetted. (expired)

Gone but not forgotten and likely to come back again real soon.
VALMET_M76 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2008, 04:54 PM   #33
akjim
Curio & Relic
 
akjim's Avatar
 
AKaholic #: 7245
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: maine woods
Posts: 2,547
Default Help a newbie builder...

HELP

I am totally confused....sorry for being an idiot but I have to ask. I purchased a couple Romy G Kits from a couple file members. They are in excellent condition so I went out and picked up a NODAK reciever and ak builder rivet set and shepard's hook replacement. So if I have the US built reciever, I'll still need to replace another 3 parts from the kit in order to make it legal? Does the US made magazine that's on the original parts list count as one? I've been refinishing the stocks and would hate to have to dump some part if it is still in great shape just to make the ATF happy.....
__________________
LET US SPEAK COURTEOUSLY, DEAL FAIRLY, AND KEEP OURSELVES ARMED AND READY,,,,,TEDDY ROOSEVELT 1903

WOO HOOO WHAT A RIDE !

"SQUADRON LEADER AKJIM, 11 GROUP AKF, REPORTING FOR NIGHT ZEPPELIN INTERCEPT DUTY,,, AS ORDERED SIR"
akjim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2008, 07:15 PM   #34
KernelKrink
Curio & Relic
 
KernelKrink's Avatar
 
AKaholic #: 2036
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 9,268
Default

A Romanian G rifle has 16 countable parts when assembled and a magazine is attached. You are allowed only 10 foreign made parts from the list, so 6 have to go to be legal.


The magazine counts as 3 separate parts on the list (mag body, follower, baseplate) so a US made mag will drop your count by 3.

The Nodak receiver counts as 1 part.

You now need 2 more parts replaced to be legal with a US made mag, most people replace the hammer, trigger, and disconnector (3 parts on the list).

Foreign mags are generally more reliable and durable than US made ones. Assuming a new FCG and receiver (4 parts) you now need 2 more to get you to 10. The US made gas piston is commonly available and cheap, as are the US made slant brakes.
KernelKrink is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2008, 07:18 PM   #35
VALMET_M76
Temp ban-Multiple indiscretions.
 
VALMET_M76's Avatar
 
AKaholic #: 90
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 3,655
Default

Look at the list at the top of this thread.

You can only have TEN foreign made parts TOTAL in the rifle.

An AK magazine has three parts, the body, the follower, the baseplate.

Typically, for a Romy G you need a USA made trigger, hammer, disconnector, The Receiver and TWO MORE USA MADE PARTS.

How you achieve the total is up to you as there are several possible combinations.

TEN FOREIGN PARTS TOTAL, you can have as many USA parts as you want but for a ROMY G with muzzle threads you need at least 6 USA parts.

The thing to remember is that no more than TEN of the parts in the list above can be FOREIGN.
VALMET_M76 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:41 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.