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Old 10-18-2012, 06:18 PM   #1
Dave Williams
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Default Single stack vs. double stack bolt comparison

Okay, so I was reading in another thread about how there are different bolts.

I guess the bolt that was designed for single stack magazine guns is different than that for the double stack mags.

Does anyone have a picture of these two bolts side by side for comparison?

I'd love to see what they look like and how they differ.

I have an AMD-65 FEG build. I know that when it came into the country the mag well was for single stack mags and Century or whomever had to open up the mag well. So that got me to wondering....."Is my bolt a single or double stack?"

A friend of mine owns a genuine pre ban AK from Egypt and we compared our two bolts. There was virtually no difference at all. The lug in the front which catches the bullet and guides it in were almost exactly the same size. His was just a touch wider, about .020 (that's 20 thousandths of an inch difference).

I have a hard time believing what I have is NOT a double stack bolt. There's no way this bolt could pass through the opening in the top of a single stack mag.....I think. I don't actually have a single stack mag here to check, but I'm assuming that the difference would be much greater than 20 thousandths.

So anyone got both and care to post up a pic?

Thanks.
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Old 10-18-2012, 06:30 PM   #2
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this was on the net @ ak files...lol

Last edited by kiki; 10-19-2012 at 06:57 PM.
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Old 10-18-2012, 07:45 PM   #3
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Thank you kiki!

My AMD bolt is a double stack bolt.

Awesome. I thought so.
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Old 10-18-2012, 09:17 PM   #4
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Was wondering the same thing.

Given all the carping over the hi-cap PAPs single-stack bolts, was wondering how all the bagillion home-hi-capped WASRs with single-stack bolts could work so well - while the PAPs supposedly have so many issues.
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Old 10-18-2012, 09:30 PM   #5
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WASR and AMD and other imports have standard milsurp bolts.
The PAP Yugoslavian rifles are the main source of the single stack bolt talk these days.
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Old 10-18-2012, 10:10 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AKBLUE View Post
WASR and AMD and other imports have standard milsurp bolts.
The PAP Yugoslavian rifles are the main source of the single stack bolt talk these days.
Iirc, the SA-2000M Hungarian rifles also had bolts made for single stack mags.. and problems similar to the PAP's when it comes to reliably feeding from standard double-stack mags. I'm unaware of any other foreign AK's that are imported without standard bolts.
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Old 10-18-2012, 10:20 PM   #7
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My AMD is an SA-2000M receiver. It's stamped right on the bottom near the mag well. And as I said, my bolt is the standard mil surp double stack bolt.
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Old 10-18-2012, 11:38 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Williams View Post
My AMD is an SA-2000M receiver. It's stamped right on the bottom near the mag well. And as I said, my bolt is the standard mil surp double stack bolt.
Ok, I guess it varies.

I just know that I've read that the rifles that were sold as SA-2000M's, (not AMD-style, but regular AKM front end), have single-stack bolts.

I haven't examined one myself. The only Hungarian rifle that I own is still on its way to me; a post-ban SA-85M, and I know there are no similar issues with that model.
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Old 10-19-2012, 08:18 PM   #9
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Single stack on the left, double stack on the right


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Old 10-19-2012, 11:47 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Highpower View Post
Single stack on the left, double stack on the right


OK... I'll ask again.

My 1973-arsenal-dated single-stack "GP WASR 10/63" has the single-stack bolt on the left, my dub-stack Draco has the dub-stack bolt as on the right.

So - how is it that folks can hog-out single-stack WASRs with their single-stack bolts - and not have any issues, while PAPs with single-stack bolts have so many issues?
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Old 10-21-2012, 07:51 PM   #11
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FEG sa 2000m-
no pics but feeder part is 8.13mm
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Old 10-22-2012, 10:00 AM   #12
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My SA2000 has a narrow feed part that will only feed rounds from the right side of the magazine. To convert it to double stack magazines I had to buy a new bolt, trigger guard, mag catch and widen the magazine well.
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Old 10-23-2012, 07:37 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nfafan View Post
OK... I'll ask again.

My 1973-arsenal-dated single-stack "GP WASR 10/63" has the single-stack bolt on the left, my dub-stack Draco has the dub-stack bolt as on the right.

So - how is it that folks can hog-out single-stack WASRs with their single-stack bolts - and not have any issues, while PAPs with single-stack bolts have so many issues?

Good question. In the above picture the single stack bolt on the left is out of my PAP. I replaced it without having fired it after the conversion as I felt that there was not enough contact with the rear of the round being fed out of the magazine. It MAY have worked OK, I just didn't want to take a chance on having feeding issues.

One of these days I might take it to the range with the original bolt and see how it works. Perhaps the bolt on the WASR is the original double stack bolt and they don't change it for the single stack imports?

But I still don't see what all the hoopala is about regarding changing out the bolt. It takes way less than a minute to do it and quite honestly if I had a WASR that was converted and it had a bolt like the PAP does, I would change it.
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Old 10-23-2012, 09:03 AM   #14
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I have yet to see these two words in this thread:

Headspace gauges.

If you just swap out the bolt and dont check the headspace afterwards then you shouldnt be playing with the gun. This applies to everybody, it isnt directed at any one person in this thread.
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Old 10-23-2012, 08:16 PM   #15
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Good point

I used a go/no-go gauge that I borrowed from a friend. There is no way that I would shoot any gun after a bolt change without checking the headspace. In my case, the bolt headspaced just fine.
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Old 10-23-2012, 10:28 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Highpower View Post


Perhaps the bolt on the WASR is the original double stack bolt and they don't change it for the single stack imports?

Nope, WASR bolt is factory ground/re-blued to fit inside the narrow opening of a single-stack mag.
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Old 10-23-2012, 10:35 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Williams View Post
My AMD is an SA-2000M receiver. It's stamped right on the bottom near the mag well. And as I said, my bolt is the standard mil surp double stack bolt.
Is there a serial number on the sheet metal or just on the front trunnion?
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Old 10-23-2012, 10:46 PM   #18
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If what you have is one of the tgi import feg guns, you will have a double stack bolt. Both of mine do, and the others i know of locally do too. The bolt to the eye is virtually identical to my m92 pistol.
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Old 10-24-2012, 08:17 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by allesennogwat View Post
Is there a serial number on the sheet metal or just on the front trunnion?
Serial number is on the front trunnion. Underneath stamped on the receiver just in front of the mag well is "SA 2000M TGI KNOX TN"
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Old 10-25-2012, 07:07 PM   #20
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Default single or double?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Highpower View Post
Single stack on the left, double stack on the right


Nice thread....just wondering....Tigers game just started & I don't want
to go break anything down and miss anything........

Anyone know which bolt a 1999 CAI Maadi MISR S/A would be sportin'..?

Guess I could always wait until the 7th inning stretch......

.......


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Old 10-27-2012, 07:08 PM   #21
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Default BOLT...

Still difficult to tell from pics...

My Maadi bolt measures ~0.420" across the face...vertically in the
pic below.

Then the battery died in my calipers!......dammit!...but I got a real
quick measurement around ~0.180-0.2? horizontally...JUST before
the display quit!

I'll get another battery tomorrow & try again...

Had a thought tho.... I checked the 5-round magazine that shipped with
the rifle originally (like everyone’s)...and there are TWO rows deep and
TWO columns wide of bullets in the 5-round magazine….just like all my
hi-caps…

ALL of the Military-Issue 30 & 40-round steel magazines fit & lock in place
fine…and very easily cycle…outer appearance of ALL is same also….


Even if I lock a mag in and run the bolt to empty the mag….everything is
smooth & good…



So…as far as I’m concerned… I answered my question….ha-ha......


GO TIGERS!...


-

Last edited by rockher_man; 10-27-2012 at 08:10 PM.
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Old 11-19-2012, 01:10 AM   #22
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same here, I have a ZASTAVA M70 single-stack PAP bolt (the one not with a Picantinny dust cover) and would like to replace with AKM bolts (any will do right, like from Apexgunparts etc)...other mods are done already
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Old 11-19-2012, 07:58 PM   #23
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You must check the headspace if you change the bolt. Also you will need to grind down the bullet guide to clear the bolt. You will see if you try it.
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