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#36 |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 173263 Join Date: Jan 2014
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Problem with 69 is that it will cause problems in some US made barrels. It works good in com bloc stuff, but for some reason, US made 5.45 barrels are not so happy with it...
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#37 |
Member
AKaholic #: 191028 Join Date: Jan 2017
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Thanks for taking the time to put this together, OP. I am surprised wolf mil spec did decent. I figured they neutered it.
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#38 | |
Curio & Relic
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AKaholic #: 170327 Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Illinois
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RAS 60g and Tulammo sucks. Might as well have just shot 7.62x39 through there. Actually, Mattylight did fire a round or two from his NPAPDF to make sure the chrono was reading right, and whatever he was shooting was knocking on its back door velocity wise. Wolf Mil spec did better, and GT a little worse than we expected.
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#39 |
Old Dirty Bastard of the Files
AKaholic #: 174648 Join Date: Apr 2014
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US made barrel Nyet!
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#40 | ||
Where we go one we go all
AKaholic #: 183372 Join Date: Dec 2015
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#41 | |
Curio & Relic
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AKaholic #: 170327 Join Date: Jul 2013
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Chknfkr brought out the SBR and RPK. Mattylight had the chrono. I just picked the short straw when it came to writing up the post. ![]()
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#42 |
Curio & Relic
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I did NOT realize this till after we got out there, but the previous GT I had shot came in packages with the rounds set in there with thick paper in between layers.
The next case I ordered were packaged in paper packets stapled on each end.
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#43 |
Low balling stupid BASTARD
AKaholic #: 172241 Join Date: Nov 2013
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Mine was the stapled paper packs as well. I can get you the lot number over lunch.
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#44 |
Curio & Relic
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I know I have some of the other left. I'll dig it out after work.
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#45 |
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So was the GT you guys used a mix of the previous batch SGAmmo brought in and some of the most recent stuff?
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#46 |
Curio & Relic
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It was the more recent stuff in the stapled paper package. It was when we made it out and started loading mags I discovered the difference in packaging.
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#47 |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 171780 Join Date: Oct 2013
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Thanks for doing this, those results should be stickied
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#48 |
Banned
AKaholic #: 181728 Join Date: Aug 2015
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Thanks for sharing. Some of the data from the 16" barrel is disappointing. It's not like someone is going to get shot, look down and say, "HA, that was only 2700 FPS instead of 2900 but then again the temp may have something to do with the numbers.
I would have though the Wolf mil-spec would have been faster, oh well. |
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#49 | |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 173263 Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: USA
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Temperature: 32.0 °F Pressure: 29.92 in Hg Humidity: 50 % Altitude: 615.0 ft My results are close to theirs. I had a larger sample base on 7n6, because i have collected data from 50 rounds. I'm also calculating BC values and checking all different zeros for 74 edition of the booklet. Their findings on commercial ammo were also close match to what i have on Wolf 60gr (under powered, like a broken dick). Now, that being said, you can work with Wolf 60gr with 25yds zero somehow effectively. This is how the table is shaping on it (you can basically using it to 350yds on human torso with 25yds zero): Range Drop (yd) (in) 0 -2.5 25 0 50 2.2 75 4 100 5.4 125 6.5 150 7.1 175 7.3 200 7 225 6.2 250 4.9 275 3 300 0.5 325 -2.7 350 -6.5 |
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#50 |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 185972 Join Date: Apr 2016
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Wow awesome data guys! We need a global sticky for this kind of chrono and accuracy data as well as general reviews on other minutiae such as powder, sealing etc (problems or variations from advertised specs).
Great job folks, really appreciate the hard work and foresight to shoot it, record it, and then post it for us. Thanks.
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#51 | |
Old Dirty Bastard of the Files
AKaholic #: 174648 Join Date: Apr 2014
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#52 |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 185972 Join Date: Apr 2016
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Rob what is the muzzle velocity for the 60gr 5.45 the AKOU chart will reflect? thx
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#53 |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 173263 Join Date: Jan 2014
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Av 2637 FPS. Environmental conditions as posted above.
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#54 |
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AKaholic #: 181689 Join Date: Aug 2015
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Thanks for the data
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#55 | |
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AKaholic #: 183372 Join Date: Dec 2015
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http://www.akfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=285288 |
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#56 |
Veteran Member
AKaholic #: 191931 Join Date: Mar 2017
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That 69 grain RAS is moving... Some very unimpressive velocities out of many of the other commercial ammos though. Thanks for doing the test guys. This should definitely be a sticky.
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#57 | ||
Where we go one we go all
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#58 | ||
Low balling stupid BASTARD
AKaholic #: 172241 Join Date: Nov 2013
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Below in RED I've figured the standard deviation for each group. It's a small data set, small enough most will say it's scientifically invalid. It is interesting all the same.
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Quote:
8.25" AKS-74U 7n6 Average velocity: 2352 Standard deviation: 40 16" siaga 7n6 Average velocity: 2942 Standard deviation: 34 23" RPK-74M 7n6 Average velocity: 3057 Standard deviation: 43
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#59 |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 6541 Join Date: Sep 2006
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Thanks for sorting ot the standard deviation .
I found it very interesting. I started to do it but looking at it on a phone was a PITA. I see you guys shot in IL . how far south of the border are you?? |
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#60 | |
Old Dirty Bastard of the Files
AKaholic #: 174648 Join Date: Apr 2014
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skip to 1:40 seconds.
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#61 | |
Low balling stupid BASTARD
AKaholic #: 172241 Join Date: Nov 2013
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Elevation probably plays a role, but I'm guessing temperature plays a bigger role. Mike is in sunny South Carolina.
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#62 | |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 6541 Join Date: Sep 2006
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For those who don't know what standard deviation is
Here is a decent explination with out getting into square root type stuff. Quote:
If say 500 rounds were shot and the extra spread ( differance from fastest tp slowest) was 150 FPS but the standard deviation was under say 10 you would have a good average of consistant velocity for your ammo with a couple round way off and would likely result in fliers. What's concerning is a extreme spread of over 120 FPS or so with only 5 shots. A few factors can affect things in a 5 shot run . Barrel temp of first shot, weather a barrel is clean or lubricated,neck tension , bullet uniformity or varying surface bearing area, Powder charge, primer inconsistantsy or ease of powder to ignition, powder density or even how it's lying in a case, the amount of free bore and neck tension consistancy. The list goes on. It dosent take a lot to throw off a light bullet with a small case capacity were even a 1/4 grain makes a much bigger differance than a larger round were a simular change is a smaller percentage. You guys did a lot of work here in a short time. I find the Hornady numbers the most puzzeling. |
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#63 | |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 170271 Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Florida
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I will check the boxes of the OLD GT when I return home. |
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#64 | |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 6541 Join Date: Sep 2006
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South of Madison north of Jainsville. I sure wish I kept my 5.45 dies . I'd like to see what a couple of your rifles did with reloaded steel cases with percision weighed powder charges. If those shots are listed in order then a cold bore or lubed bore are likely out as variance causes. Frankely I'd be contacting Hornady for answers. There better than this on ammo I have ran through a chrony. ( not that much) Perhaps they might answer. |
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#65 | |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 6541 Join Date: Sep 2006
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I had abut a 500 hand loads near max that shot fine in testing in the early spring in WI. late June in South dakota at about 90 degrees I was popping primers and having a really bad day. I'd suspect Russian surplus would have powders with less temp sensitivity . You guys would know better than me. I just know it gets really cold there so it would make sense. Then again powders gave come a long ways in the last 30 years. Last edited by 1biggun; 03-20-2017 at 10:13 PM. |
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#66 | |||
Low balling stupid BASTARD
AKaholic #: 172241 Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Charleston,IL
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Quote:
They are listed in the order they were shot. Only that first mag in each gun had a cold bore. I am pretty dissapointed in the Hornady results. I expected much better from them. Quote:
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#67 |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 6541 Join Date: Sep 2006
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One would think military ammo would be pretty well researched and tested in all temps.
Ours do. Age of the ammo is a very valid . Some of that 7n6 has been stored I. Who knows were and how and it what temps it's been stored in all those years. I'd really like to know the story of the Hornady steel cases were there from who made them, who actually loaded them and whos powder . Either there likely importing empty primed cases and loading them or there having it made some were for them. Either way there not worth the asking price. The few bolt guns I know about also had poor accuracy with this stuff. |
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#68 | |
Member
AKaholic #: 186129 Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: East Texas
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wow everything except 7n6,GT and the Ukrainian RAS is horribly underloaded . tula is getting 7.62x39mm velocity |
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#69 |
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Silver Bear is good. Usually gets in the 2830-2850 range, but based on the weather the testing as done in, could be the reason why they were only getting 2760 range.
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#70 | |
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