![]() |
#3991 | |
Veteran Member
AKaholic #: 188836 Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Texas
Posts: 1,084
|
![]() Quote:
Learn how to communicate with others correctly and this wouldnt happen. You are too arrogant to understand this though. I dont think any cartridge is any better or worse than another when used as intended. Depends on the need. Pick any cartridge and there are 10 more that would be considered redundant. All this shit over a cartridge. Stupid. Im done and im out. |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#3992 | |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 185454 Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: In the Back of Your Mind
Posts: 18,319
|
![]() Quote:
![]()
__________________
"Socialism will succeed only to the degree that government is able to achieve oppression"- Erich Mielke, Head Of East German Ministry for State Security(STASI) "As director of the American Civil Liberties Union, I am for Socialism, disarmament and ultimately for abolishing the State itself...we seek the social ownership of property...and the sole control of those who produce wealth. Communism is the goal." -1935, Roger Baldwin, Founder ACLU |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#3993 |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 183589 Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Indiana
Posts: 5,079
|
![]()
Full auto is a waste of ammo in a real fight
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#3994 |
Senior Member
Contributor
AKaholic #: 187397 Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Florida
Posts: 501
|
![]()
I have an AR-15, but I only buy M193 for it because it’s cheap and I can stack it deep for SHTF. It’s good enough at stopping humans (provided the velocity is sufficient). There are more effective loads at higher weights but they are also more expensive.
I like 5.45 because it’s even cheaper than M193 and for stopping humans it’s good enough. I like that it relies more on tumbling than fragmenting, to me that seems like a good idea because it doesn’t depend on velocity. I prefer both 5.45 and 5.56 over 7.62x39 because they seem to perform better on soft tissue, are less likely to over penetrate, are lighter and have less recoil. I like to keep it simple. I want the cheapest effective round that I can buy a shitload of for the cheapest amount. I shoot the same round at the range that I keep for self defense. If I ever need to use it for self defense, it’s good enough. I can’t make someone deader than dead. The rest is wasted on me. So in my eyes, yes 5.45 is better than 5.56 because I can stock more of it and at the price point I’m looking for the performance is more or less the same. |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#3995 |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 6541 Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,823
|
![]()
Really? Ever been in one ??? was it when you Moms basement was invaded ?
Funny solders seem to keep using it . funny 100,000 ,0000 AK all have it for the most part . this from the Russians who gave out one rifle for three solders in WWII Ever shoot a FA ? I have if there is three zombies you coming all you got to do is sweep in one direction . Im no solder but FA has it s place . Nobody here is going to be in a fire fight with there 5.45 and if they do the ammo situation is the last of there worries . Id love a full auto AK 74 so would about every guy on this site . Making up excuses why its not better because you cant have it is lame . It also has nothing to do with the subject . I concede the 5.45 might have one advantage and you still want to fucking argue about shit not related . who cares if its a waste of ammo ??? the round might be better in FA but you still want to argue . |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#3996 | |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 6541 Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,823
|
![]() Quote:
so what is your cost savings of getting a AK and a AR and having two different rifles and mags when cost of defense is your main concern . Nothing against you having all the stuff you want but the whole I need cheap ammo to defend my self argument is sort of invalid if your supporting multiple calibers and rifle platforms . I never said 5.45 is not good enough . Id really love to here your envisioned defense scenario were the 5.45 and the 5.56 is going to have any different out come in your survival ??? I place a value on my and my families life higher than 23 cents a round and if I could not afford good ammo I sure the hell would not stack a mountain of crappy ammo I could not afford . I don't have old used corrosive military ammo governed by the rules of war to defend my life . I have he meanest nastiest stuff made to kill not incapacitate living creatures If its $1 round so be it . I don't expect to ever actually fire any if it a people any way . To each there own but I not buying the cost savings that much . what is your envisioned needed stash for this SHTF event and how much are you saving ???? Other than a 22 LR I doubt I own a rifle round thats not going to stop a person in a defensive situation including the M1 carbine . |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#3997 | ||
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 6541 Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,823
|
![]() Quote:
All that about what I can do with a AK is because of there being options. thick ?? after 100 plus pages you cant grasp that its about what round is better not what round and rifle is better . Not my problem there is only a few options for the 5.45 . and hundreds of 223/ 5.56 choices including more factory built and issues AK variants in 223 than there is in 5.56 . including rifles like the Galil that have models that are not carbines and have longer barrel's for more precision work . Thick is thinking this is all about the AK 74 and nothing else and disregarding the subject . You think im the only one shooting at little things with a small bore rifle ??? were do you think the millions of rounds of good ammo in 223 go ???? You think its all bolt action guys ??? 90% is guys with carbines . realize there is more guys shooting more 223 ammo in one year than likely all the 5.45 ammo ever been shot this country ever . there not all shooting human sized target . hell I likely shot more 223 ammo this week than all the 5.45 x39 ammo ever shot at a living human in the US in the last 20 years . Quote:
Hating a guy because hes right about something , guys have a emotional attachment over is pretty thick I took all your arguments into consideration and even said you had valid points . |
||
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#3998 | |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 185454 Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: In the Back of Your Mind
Posts: 18,319
|
![]() Quote:
Like I said, emotion, vs. logic. The 5.45 is best crowd, are just showing their feelings. Emoting, I guess you'd call it these days.
__________________
"Socialism will succeed only to the degree that government is able to achieve oppression"- Erich Mielke, Head Of East German Ministry for State Security(STASI) "As director of the American Civil Liberties Union, I am for Socialism, disarmament and ultimately for abolishing the State itself...we seek the social ownership of property...and the sole control of those who produce wealth. Communism is the goal." -1935, Roger Baldwin, Founder ACLU |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#3999 |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 6541 Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,823
|
![]()
AK74 +5.45 = GOOD ENOUGH
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4000 |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 174098 Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Nordland
Posts: 3,555
|
![]()
freaking comedy
__________________
Кто не скачет- это Вооружённые Силы Новороссии А кто скачет тот полный пидарас которого наебали свои-же лидеры. ![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4001 |
Low balling stupid BASTARD
AKaholic #: 172241 Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Charleston,IL
Posts: 6,566
|
![]()
It would be comedic if they didn't actually believe the BS they're spewing.
This is willful ignorance on display by OBG and our resident statist.
__________________
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4002 |
Vierfruchtpyjama
Contributor
AKaholic #: 177977 Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: San Antonio,Texas
Posts: 4,693
|
![]()
Somebody was drunk posting yesterday
__________________
☆Texas Double Bluff ///// Magaholic CTAK social group http://www.akfiles.com/forums/group.php?groupid=39 |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4003 |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 6541 Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,823
|
![]()
Facts and statics prove about everything I have said.
You don't need to believe in it. However 5.45 is like a religion were you have to believe in some unknown god or force to feel every thing is ok . ![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4004 | |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 174098 Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Nordland
Posts: 3,555
|
![]() Quote:
but hey, when you are 60 year old man who doesnt own a single AKs decides to join an AK-oriented forum and enlighten us about his lack of knowledge of them ......you know you are going to get a treat.
__________________
Кто не скачет- это Вооружённые Силы Новороссии А кто скачет тот полный пидарас которого наебали свои-же лидеры. ![]() |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4005 |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 6541 Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,823
|
![]()
All bow and worship at the alter of 5.45.
Praise the majic of the tunneling bullet Thou shalt not spite corossive powder and be swayed by thou of little faith or those of more bounty and choice May the evil of thy importer be cast from the land and The round once again rain down for thee of little fruit. May faith guide your crooked speer to thee enemy in the space of thous sacred mother dwelling below thy floor of her house and be contained in that foundation . Pray that your fellow believers find the source of the eternal offering of 5.45 and it be plentiful for thy defecation striking thee fan . Believe fellow 5.45 owners that you have chosen the David of all Spears and it shall defeat Goliath In fantasy field of battle . Thou shalt not aim for those who truly believe will be guided by the spirit of corrosive powder filled in the vessel of steel fired by a irreplaceable spark to never be used again. |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4006 |
Member
AKaholic #: 188948 Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Mountains of Westvirginia
Posts: 161
|
![]()
I had this same delima only backwards when I decided on a 74 type. Went with the 5.45 first but a 5.56 SLR106cr so I'd have both and I purchase 5.45 when I can I use cheap 5.45 tulammo for plinking,wolf lacquered and sealed as storage and only 500 rounds of 7N6 put back for that rainy day and with hornady making a steal case ballistic tip 5.45 round I plan on deer hunting with my 104ur this year while my wife will use the 5.56. It's a toss up I like both 5.56 more options most certainly accuracy is close to each other imo. I'd also add that I have seen the effects of both rounds in a combat theater and by far when comparing mil ammo the 5.45 is devastating compared to a 5.56. It isn't nicknamed the poison bullet without good reason.
__________________
Fire For Effect 4 Rounds HE 2 Rounds WP ![]() Oath Keeper GOA-Because F your compromises Last edited by Kiowa; 07-02-2018 at 04:06 PM. Reason: Add in. |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4007 | |
Senior Member
Contributor
AKaholic #: 187397 Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Florida
Posts: 501
|
![]() Quote:
Not to pry but can you tell us a little more? The habibs over there have 74’s as well? I always kinda figured they’d only have 47’s for some reason. |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4008 |
Member
AKaholic #: 188948 Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Mountains of Westvirginia
Posts: 161
|
![]()
Quite a few 74s mainly AKSU but mostly 7.62. with typical mil loads our 5.56 would smoke through individuals and being hot it tended to self cauterize alot and the entrance and exit typically smaller holes so we always knew when one of the "villagers" needed a GSW treatment and it was a smaller wound and non vital hit he most likely was the same MFer we just got attacked by and returned fire. And we could always tell if it was a legit villager who was attacked by a Tali and hit by a 5.45 or 7.62 the 5.45 chewed shit up inside to exit,entrance was about same diameter as 5.56 unless it tumbled b4 impact which happened from worn to shit AK'S and the 7.62 was easy to spot bigger hole massive tissue damage from it but typically not as much blood loss as the 5.45 would create. Now if not for Geneva convention and restrictions if we could use a ballistic tip,hollow point or even my least preferred a soft point I have no doubt the 5.56 would cause a ton of damage my son took his first buck last year with a 5.56 deer still ran 300 yds but it did the job. for me I'm a 308 kinda guy I like my deer to drop and not get back up lol I plan on trying 5.45 hornady loads this year to see the difference.
__________________
Fire For Effect 4 Rounds HE 2 Rounds WP ![]() Oath Keeper GOA-Because F your compromises Last edited by Kiowa; 07-03-2018 at 09:12 AM. Reason: Add in. |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4009 |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 174098 Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Nordland
Posts: 3,555
|
![]()
very cool info Kiowa^^
if you google a member "X" ..i think.... over on old AKforum.net, he did some deer hunting using Hornady's 60 grain Vmax bullet and posted entrance/exit wounds of the Vmax load. When I wrote the article for Hornady on the subject in the book of the AK few years ago, I submitted all of pictures/descriptions for the Article- but they did not want to publish them as they were pretty graphic. I would post them here, but that was on my old PC which died and I no longer have them. I think the pix might be still up in the old "practical" section over there....
__________________
Кто не скачет- это Вооружённые Силы Новороссии А кто скачет тот полный пидарас которого наебали свои-же лидеры. ![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4010 |
Member
AKaholic #: 196938 Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Lake Havasu City, Arizona
Posts: 156
|
![]()
I like 5.45x39, it's a fun round. I like it in my AK's, I like making #5.45MasterRace jokes. From a logistical standpoint 5.56x45 is the better round. I mean hell when I go into work to buy 5.45x39 ammo I'm usually limited to two or four different options that all seem to be getting more expensive everytime I look at them. That being said 5.45 and the 74 are second cool for me, and if I ever had to use a rifle for any serious use I'd grab my AR in 5.56x45. Also happy taco Tuesday everyone.
Last edited by Tactical Baron; 07-03-2018 at 11:32 AM. Reason: Spelling Error |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4011 |
Reconnaissance Section
AKaholic #: 177569 Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: [Redacted]
Posts: 135
|
![]()
One aspect I think everyone's missing is the benefit of having an uncommon caliber. In situations where it's more likely you'll be stolen from (vehicles parked on the street, residences in high crime areas, bugout locations), stashing 5.45x39 greatly reduces the odds that thieves can then use that ammo against you.
In that aspect, it's useful to have bullets that nearly match 5.56 in performance but can't be chambered in common rifles.
__________________
Why am I armed? Arms were evolutionarily advantageous traits of my ancestors. They can be used for tool making. And hugs. |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4012 | |
Member
AKaholic #: 184494 Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: North America
Posts: 316
|
![]() Quote:
|
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4013 |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 177348 Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: IL
Posts: 4,078
|
![]()
I think that has probably come up before in the 115 pages of this thread lol.
But as I may have noted over a year ago now, that's also one of the major benefits of having firearms chambered in 5.56. I think its far more likely that you're gonna need ammo in some scenario like that. Rather than worry about it being stolen from you and being used against you. So +1 again for 5.56 if you're living in America. One of the most common calibers around.
__________________
Islam Delenda Est. |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4014 | |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 6541 Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,823
|
![]() Quote:
Brilliant . Im going to go order a 32 rim fire tomorrow . No way im getting shot with my own ammo . food for thought . Don't you think the thieves already have a 223 or 5.56 and will shoot you any way ?? Dont you think if 5.45 gets banned or sanctioned that it will become a target for criminals to go after because it will be more expensive to sell to 5.45 fan boys who need ammo??. Some guys leave a POS rifle in the open so it gets stolen and they don't find the safe hidden being the wall . I think a crate of 5.45 on the coffee table would be a good decoy to leave out . In fact I now want a coffee table made from 5.45 cases . ![]() Man you guys are really stretching it to find a way 5.45 is better LOL I can see you at the gun shop. No way I don't want a 308 win give me a 7.65×53mm Argentine instead you would be a fool to buy a popular round guys steal it all the time will and shoot me . Keep that 223 away from me I don't want to die form my own ammo . Give me something inferior nobody wants please . Come on you can do better . ![]() Last edited by 1biggun; 07-10-2018 at 08:43 PM. |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4015 |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 6541 Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,823
|
![]()
Or buy a 223 ammo because if some one breaks in and steals you rifle you can actually buy another one to shoot the ammo you have .
it would suck to have 500,000 rounds of 5.45 ammo not be able to find a affordable rifle to shoot it LOL |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4016 | |
Reconnaissance Section
AKaholic #: 177569 Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: [Redacted]
Posts: 135
|
![]() Quote:
Yes, if the thieves can shoot you, they probably will, regardless of caliber, 5.56 included. But they'll be limited in options if they can't easily resupply off your stash of weird calibers. That's helpful to your family and community even if you're dead and gone. Typical criminals are idiots and wouldn't think to play the market of banned rounds, but when if they were criminal masterminds, having a 5.56 stash doesn't make you immune to that. If anything it makes you a bigger target since they're guaranteed buyers for your hoard which might make a risky raid worth it for the payoff. You're putting words in my mouth. I'm not worried about anything. My firearms are mostly for fun, and that includes my AKS74 clone. Your Argentine Mauser example will fall into that category too. What I'm saying is that if you already own an inferior caliber rifle, that you might as well include it in your arsenal and survival plans, because it brings certain advantages, even if in your opinion they're not worth it. As discussed ad nauseam in the previous posts, 5.45 (or 5.7 or whatever) does not trail by a significant amount behind 5.56. I could've invested in another 5.56 rifle, but not doing so isn't a death warrant either. And all of the performance shortcomings aside from ballistics can be addressed with superior fitness, tactics and logistics, and even then most people won't have enough of any of them to tell the difference. If odd calibers is what you enjoy, so be it, and don't think of them as utterly useless rifles compared to AR15s in 5.56. The disadvantage matters less than you think.
__________________
Why am I armed? Arms were evolutionarily advantageous traits of my ancestors. They can be used for tool making. And hugs. |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4017 |
Reconnaissance Section
AKaholic #: 177569 Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: [Redacted]
Posts: 135
|
![]()
This isn't a thread questioning the best rifle. Availability of quality 5.45 rifles in the US currently sucks. It's a thread about the usefulness of 5.45 compared to 5 56. Everyone seems to miss the point and likes to go off on tangents.
__________________
Why am I armed? Arms were evolutionarily advantageous traits of my ancestors. They can be used for tool making. And hugs. |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4018 | |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 6541 Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,823
|
![]() Quote:
Seriously this is a reason to have a 5.45 over 223 . Good Grief. If you irresponsible enough to leave stashes of ammo in remote locations that can't be secured or hidden then you need to rethink things. The notion that a criminal can find your stash but is to stupid to find a rifle to shoot it is pretty ubsurd. I'll stick with a fire arm that has ammo being made and sold by multipul companies and countries and sold in every place that carries ammo. VS some mofidite crap that may be banned and aparently now according to you has firearms in such short supply criminals can find one to shoot me with my own ammo. Absurd. Great plan goes right along with having a Studibaker pick up for your urban assult vehicle . Nobody will take it because you can't get parts. . It should have a 8 track sound system so criminals won't steal it and you Peaches and Erb soundtrack. |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4019 | |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 6541 Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,823
|
![]() Quote:
5.56 is cheaper, faster, more accurate, reloadable, more avaliable, better selection , and has multipul types of fire arms to shoot it in. |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4020 | |
Reconnaissance Section
AKaholic #: 177569 Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: [Redacted]
Posts: 135
|
![]() Quote:
That being said, if you happen to like the round (because it's good enough for lots of applications, or because it's a legacy round back from when it was much cheaper, or whatever), you can use its massive incompatibility to your favor. If you control the rifle, the ammo is close to useless; control the ammo and the rifle is close to useless. I was just listing creative ways that you could make that particular quality work in your system, in ways that 5.56 can't due to its ubiquity.
__________________
Why am I armed? Arms were evolutionarily advantageous traits of my ancestors. They can be used for tool making. And hugs. |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4021 | |
Reconnaissance Section
AKaholic #: 177569 Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: [Redacted]
Posts: 135
|
![]() Quote:
I don't worry that much about getting stolen from. I'm not saying that it's not beneficial to have a 5.56 in America. I've got one myself. They're handy. If the question were asked, "In what ways is an AK74 better than an M4?" then I might answer "Lower bore axis iron sights," and I feel like someone would still reply "Durr hurr, AKs aren't accurate anyway and peep sights are superior for accuracy in every way." I could answer "Ease / availability of folding stocks and firing while folded," and someone would shout, "You can't use them with optics and shooting folded has limited tactical value." I could answer "Ease of QD muzzle devices," and someone would say, "And all of them suck." None of these responses are *incorrect,* but neither do they address my hypothetical answers either. This is why judges recommend most people get a lawyer to speak on their behalf. It's like arguing with children and I'm embarrassed to continue for much longer, but please, feel free to keep entertaining me.
__________________
Why am I armed? Arms were evolutionarily advantageous traits of my ancestors. They can be used for tool making. And hugs. Last edited by rediius; 07-13-2018 at 05:51 PM. Reason: Typos |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4022 | |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 6541 Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,823
|
![]() Quote:
|
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4023 |
Senior Member
AKaholic #: 193880 Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Levittown Pennsylvania
Posts: 930
|
![]()
It's not, the differences in performance would depend on the particular load so your better off with the caliber that you have more availability where you live l
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4024 |
Curio & Relic
AKaholic #: 174098 Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Nordland
Posts: 3,555
|
![]()
man some people are bored...
__________________
Кто не скачет- это Вооружённые Силы Новороссии А кто скачет тот полный пидарас которого наебали свои-же лидеры. ![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4025 | |
Reconnaissance Section
AKaholic #: 177569 Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: [Redacted]
Posts: 135
|
![]() Quote:
And yes Voron, I'm bored.
__________________
Why am I armed? Arms were evolutionarily advantageous traits of my ancestors. They can be used for tool making. And hugs. |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 5 (0 members and 5 guests) | |
Thread Tools | |
|
|