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Old 01-11-2018, 10:31 AM   #1
JoeCorrado
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Default Which one should I buy?

Looking at 2 different rifles and I'm on the fence on which one I should get. No, I can't afford both and I would grab both if I could. Market is stagnant so I'm not selling anything at a loss.

First is what appears to be a Gen 2 for lack of better terms Archer with cleaning kit, collapsible stock, rail and two circle 10 mags. 2012 date on the trunnion. Doesn't have the original box.

Second is an SGL31-85 with one magazine and the original box.

I'm on the fence because the SGL checks several of the boxes on what I wanted out of my next AK: 5.45, banned, triangle folder, and a SAIGA. Honestly didn't think I would find one of these, especially all of what I was looking for in one rifle but it kinda just appeared from nowhere. OTOH I've been wanting an Archer for a couple of years and a few have slipped threw my fingers. It seems like they're only going to go up in price and may go beyond what I'm willing to pay. I have an SA M-5 already so rare 5.56 AK is covered in my collection. Just not sure which I should get or which one has better collectability. Also, I'm not concerned about ammo availability or magazines.
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Old 01-11-2018, 10:41 AM   #2
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Personally I want one of each but I'd probably go for the SGL purely because mags are easier to find. Since you already have a 5.56 AK with compatible mags it's a little different for you.

A thought that crosses my mind is that we know there will never be any more Saigas coming in because of legal reasons, but there's a chance (regardless of how small) that Beryls/Archers will come in. What I mean by that is that there aren't sanctions against Poland/FB Radom.

The SGL will probably be more collectible in the long run because it's the closest thing to a real Russian AK74M we can get.

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Old 01-11-2018, 11:27 AM   #3
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SGL31
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Old 01-11-2018, 11:34 AM   #4
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SGL
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Old 01-11-2018, 11:41 AM   #5
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What the price of each?

If price doesn't matter, then it comes down to what purpose it's going to serve. Personally I'd go with the Archer. I'm more into collecting tho and I'm not a fan of the FIME marked Saiga's.
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Old 01-11-2018, 11:57 AM   #6
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$1600 for the SGL, I think $1700 for the Archer. I was thinking SGL myself but with what 2 Archer's have recently sold for on Gunbroker, it gave me pause and so I figured I would ask here since this is where all the AK aficionados are.
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Old 01-11-2018, 12:52 PM   #7
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definitely SGL
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Old 01-11-2018, 03:16 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by JoeCorrado View Post
$1600 for the SGL, I think $1700 for the Archer. I was thinking SGL myself but with what 2 Archer's have recently sold for on Gunbroker, it gave me pause and so I figured I would ask here since this is where all the AK aficionados are.
Not a bad price for the SGL. I'd go that route.
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Old 01-11-2018, 08:03 PM   #9
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Last 2 gen 3 Archers sold at $4600+ and $5000 on GB... that should pull up gen 2ís....
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Old 01-12-2018, 11:01 AM   #10
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Last 2 gen 3 Archers sold at $4600+ and $5000 on GB... that should pull up gen 2ís....
I'm thinking that as well. I guess if another crossed my path I may try and get it. I'm tired of waiting on the HPA so I just bought 2 cans so the rest of my gun fund it gone unless I sell something out of the safe or trade. Thanks for the advice everyone!
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Old 01-12-2018, 01:06 PM   #11
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Gen 2 Archer without a doubt. It's not only the better rifle, it's a far better investment. (only 800 Archers in the USA)


My Gen 3.
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Old 01-12-2018, 01:18 PM   #12
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Definitely go with the Gen2 Acher for the reasons Hansellhd stated.
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Old 01-12-2018, 03:17 PM   #13
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Definitely go with the Gen2 Acher for the reasons Hansellhd stated.
Exactly.

Although (probably highly...) unlikely, bans can be lifted so Saigas "never" coming in is not necessary true.

Even though I only have V1 Archer I would take it anyday over Saiga.
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Old 01-12-2018, 03:38 PM   #14
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LOL

how is the archer chambered in 22shit better than SGL?
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Old 01-12-2018, 03:45 PM   #15
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Waiting for the HPA to pass is like waiting for Feinstein to go pro-gun.....Also get the SGL. But if you go archer, PM me the link maybe?
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Old 01-12-2018, 05:26 PM   #16
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LOL

how is the archer chambered in 22shit better than SGL?
I'm not the biggest fan of 223/5,56Nato, but at least that ammo will be always around here in USA. How many domestic rifles are chambered in 5,45x39 ? I can see that being a possible problem at some point, getting 5,45 ammo in decent price.

I don't hate Saiga or 5,45 but to me getting ammo from everywhere, even Wal Mart, is a big bonus for owning an 5,56Nato Archer.
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Old 01-13-2018, 10:08 AM   #17
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Back at square one again. I listed a few guns locally for sale. Last time I tried this, all I got were trade offers. Nothing cash. Going for both of them I guess.

Then wouldn't you know it, a Robinson M96 pops up for sale a couple hours away with the original box. Someone is trying to torture me....
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Old 01-13-2018, 10:26 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arsniper View Post
Last 2 gen 3 Archers sold at $4600+ and $5000 on GB... that should pull up gen 2ís....
Holy crap......
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Old 01-13-2018, 01:12 PM   #19
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LOL

how is the archer chambered in 22shit better than SGL?
That shit round has killed plenty all over the world, maybe you haven't noticed.

Anyhow I own and enjoy AK's chambered in 5.56/5.45/7.62 & 8MM.
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Old 01-13-2018, 01:42 PM   #20
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i am still trying to wrap my mind how is a Russian made SGL is worse than potato vodka Archer? in what way? the metallurgy? the heat treating? Quality of steel? better made barrel? Better accuracy?

I noticed in another thread you tried telling people that Valmets are so superior to a standard Russian made AKs, and when I asked why all I got was crickets chirping.
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Old 01-13-2018, 03:45 PM   #21
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i am still trying to wrap my mind how is a Russian made SGL is worse than potato vodka Archer? in what way? the metallurgy? the heat treating? Quality of steel? better made barrel? Better accuracy?

I noticed in another thread you tried telling people that Valmets are so superior to a standard Russian made AKs, and when I asked why all I got was crickets chirping.
Maybe if you owned them you would understand, both rifles are roughly equal however like I said before the Archer IMHO is a higher quality build and as a collectable it will far outstrip the Russian Gun in worth. (same with the Valmet rifles) For some reason you seem to think if it's not made in Russia it suck's.

Sorry but there are other Guns worth having/shooting.

I have no problem with Russian guns I one several of them, my favorite to shoot is my VEPR-FM in 5.45. (just as accurate as the Archer)



Bottom line is the Op asked a question, I gave him my answer. If you or others don't like that well tough shit.
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Old 01-13-2018, 03:50 PM   #22
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That would be a tough call for me too. Love both but a gen II would be my choice looking at how things are now. I just updated my genII with the current rail at Royal Tiger.
http://www.royaltigerimports.com/product-p/bronir05.htm
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Old 01-13-2018, 07:27 PM   #23
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Picking up the SGL this week. Getting it with 5 circle 21 mags, 45rd RPK mag, a tin of 7n6, 700rds of golden tiger, 2 slings and a Bulgarian bayonet. Working on the Archer as well. Fingers crossed I can pull this off without royally pissing off my wife. This place is a terrible influence!!!
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Old 01-14-2018, 01:27 AM   #24
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Just tell her there was a two for one deal.
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Old 01-14-2018, 10:00 PM   #25
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Only 800 Archers were imported because there was little to no demand for them.
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Old 01-14-2018, 11:23 PM   #26
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Only 800 Archers were imported because there was little to no demand for them.
That's because IO did a shit job marketing them, they were too involved pushing their own garbage AK's. If the BERYL/Archer were re-introduced into the American market today they would sell like hot cakes.

Just like these fake BERYL rifles sold out in days.

http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/comp....html?Itemid=0
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Old 01-14-2018, 11:49 PM   #27
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Gen 2 Archer without a doubt. It's not only the better rifle, it's a far better investment. (only 800 Archers in the USA)


My Gen 3.
hanselhd, just gotta say you have an awesome collection! Love looking at your pics!

I'm curious how many SGL31-85's have been imported. It seems to have low numbers as well. I guess we may never know for sure due to Arsenal not releasing import numbers.
I keep going back and forth on the Archer. Hate to pass on it but at the same time I don't want to sell much else that I already have. It's missing the box so I'm not sure what that does to the value. I like getting everything from the factory with what I buy. Decisions, decisions...
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Old 01-14-2018, 11:59 PM   #28
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hanselhd, just gotta say you have an awesome collection! Love looking at your pics!

I'm curious how many SGL31-85's have been imported. It seems to have low numbers as well. I guess we may never know for sure due to Arsenal not releasing import numbers.
I keep going back and forth on the Archer. Hate to pass on it but at the same time I don't want to sell much else that I already have. It's missing the box so I'm not sure what that does to the value. I like getting everything from the factory with what I buy. Decisions, decisions...
Thanks. FWIW many Archers were sold without any box but in a hard case like the one I have. The one that sold on GB for 5K the other day did not have a box.
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Old 01-15-2018, 12:50 AM   #29
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Thanks. FWIW many Archers were sold without any box but in a hard case like the one I have. The one that sold on GB for 5K the other day did not have a box.
Interesting. Did not know that but with it being imported by IO, I shouldn't be surprised.
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Old 01-15-2018, 12:50 PM   #30
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Maybe if you owned them you would understand, both rifles are roughly equal however like I said before the Archer IMHO is a higher quality build and as a collectable it will far outstrip the Russian Gun in worth. (same with the Valmet rifles) For some reason you seem to think if it's not made in Russia it suck's.

Sorry but there are other Guns worth having/shooting.

I have no problem with Russian guns I one several of them, my favorite to shoot is my VEPR-FM in 5.45. (just as accurate as the Archer)



Bottom line is the Op asked a question, I gave him my answer. If you or others don't like that well tough shit.
LOL

i do own those guns. thats why i asked the question.

Archer is a "higher" quality build? LOL

once again how so? Is it the finish? is it rivet shape? what makes in "higher"???

nevermind dude.
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Old 01-15-2018, 10:34 PM   #31
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LOL

i do own those guns. thats why i asked the question.

Archer is a "higher" quality build? LOL

once again how so? Is it the finish? is it rivet shape? what makes in "higher"???

nevermind dude.
The fit and finish of the Archer is a step up from the SGL. Out of all my AKs Iíve owned the Archer was the nicest.
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Old 01-16-2018, 02:05 PM   #32
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Get then both cant have to many 74s

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Old 01-16-2018, 09:31 PM   #33
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I have a gen 2 archer and 2 SGLs 1 legion 31-94 and one fime 31-68 and I think I’d still go with the Russian SGLs. Granted only 800 beryls are here, but there is absolutely nothing preventing more from coming in. Russians AKs on the other hand? I doubt we see any in the next 3 years unfortunately. For me nothing beats a Russian Izhmash made AK74. I’d get both cause that’s what I did and you really can’t go wrong either way, but I have both and would take the SGL.
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Old 01-16-2018, 11:32 PM   #34
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I'm picking up the SGL on Thursday after work with a lot of extras for what I feel is a decent deal. Working on getting the Archer as well. Probably going to sell my SAM7SF to help pay for it. Hate to do it but there's no way I would sell either of my other 2 Arsenal's. Hard to replace an SA93 or SAM5. Almost sold my VEPR with the thumbhole stock but I decided to keep it. Don't see them much anymore either.
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Old 01-18-2018, 10:30 PM   #35
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Picked up the SGL earlier this evening. What a sweet rifle!! Can't wait to take this to the range!

No deal on the Archer. I'm patient though. If the stars align, one will find it's way into my safe. For now I'm thrilled with the SGL!
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