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Old 02-11-2018, 07:34 AM   #1
zulu don
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Default California/Hungarian AMD

I have an AMD 65 kit I am about to complete. In the state of California, we still have mandatory assault rifle registration. Included are bullet button weapons. My question: If I Pin a ten round magazine semi-permanently and serialize the weapon to compliance, can I then keep it with original features such as forward pistol grip and side folding stock? Or will I still have to register it as an assault weapon because of so-called features? Thanks

Last edited by zulu don; 02-11-2018 at 08:07 AM.
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Old 02-11-2018, 10:55 AM   #2
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Crazy Californication laws
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Old 02-11-2018, 12:36 PM   #3
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As of January 1, 2018 Bullet buttons have been rendered useless in California on any rifle that is being built. As of the aforementioned date NO "Assult Weapon" can be built or bought in California unless it is built "featureless", having no "evil features" (flash hider, telescopic or folding stock, pistol grip). The only way to build or buy an AR or AK and other AW is to make them "Featureless".

As far as the serial number on a 80% receiver...
Don't put a serial number on it yet. California is going to have certified engravers that will report the new serial to the California DOJ. So any number will not work.

It sucks I know...!
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Old 02-11-2018, 12:43 PM   #4
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As of January 1, 2018 Bullet buttons have been rendered useless in California on any rifle that is being built. As of the aforementioned date NO "Assult Weapon" can be built or bought in California unless it is built "featureless", having no "evil features" (flash hider, telescopic or folding stock, pistol grip). The only way to build or buy an AR or AK and other AW is to make them "Featureless".

As far as the serial number on a 80% receiver...
Don't put a serial number on it yet. California is going to have certified engravers that will report the new serial to the California DOJ. So any number will not work.

It sucks I know...!
Wow, those are some limited options.
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Old 02-11-2018, 12:56 PM   #5
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No, because of the forward grip.

It will be legal if you remove the front grip AND either remove the pistol grip or add a grip wrap.
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Old 02-11-2018, 02:02 PM   #6
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Featureless OR fixed mag with features. Featureless is preferable for rifles, but for pistols the only reasonable solution is a fixed mag.

Not sure if anyone makes a fixed mag for AK, so you would have to either modify them or add a nut and bolt somewhere to attach it such that action has to be open to remove it.

As for underfolders a brass bushing from the hardware store plumbing section cut in half with a small hose clamp around it does the trick.
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Old 02-11-2018, 02:49 PM   #7
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As far as the serial number on a 80% receiver...
Don't put a serial number on it yet. California is going to have certified engravers that will report the new serial to the California DOJ. So any number will not work.
Not sure where you heard this, but its incorrect.

The new law requires that builders apply for serial #’s with the CA-DOJ. The new number must be engraved within 10 days of the built firearm. This new law does not start until 7/1/18

The forward grip on AK’s kinda out there in limbo in regards to legality. A letter was released by the ATF a few years back stating that forward grips like the AMD65 were considered just “factory handguards” by the ATF. This is obviously opposite of what CA-DOJ thinks. So you’re kinda taking your chances with the LEO you may meet on any given day, in regards to compliance...

Personally, my AMD65 and AKM63 don’t have the forward grips on them, since Im not willing to bet any future LEO’s that may see them know whats legal or not. I still own the stock forward grips, as CA does not have a constructive possesion law.
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Old 02-11-2018, 02:51 PM   #8
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I'm sorry OP.

You shouldn't have to ask these questions.
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Old 02-11-2018, 02:53 PM   #9
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Link to new regs, for your reading pleasure...

https://d3n8a8pro7vhmx.cloudfront.ne...pdf?1517438166

Keep up the fight people! Support the NRA!
If this works in CA, other states will try it also...

BTW- Kamala Harris was our AG when all this started for CA. She is running for president in 3 years folks...

Last edited by Oldmandan; 02-11-2018 at 03:02 PM.
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Old 02-11-2018, 04:35 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by zulu don View Post
I have an AMD 65 kit I am about to complete. In the state of California, we still have mandatory assault rifle registration. Included are bullet button weapons. My question: If I Pin a ten round magazine semi-permanently and serialize the weapon to compliance, can I then keep it with original features such as forward pistol grip and side folding stock? Or will I still have to register it as an assault weapon because of so-called features? Thanks
If the side folding stock is functional than it would be considered an SBR since the length would be under the 26 inches California requires. This would be illegal and an automatic felony.

You'd either have to pin the side folder rendering useless or if you wish to keep the side folder and it's function then pin a barrel extender and call it a day.
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Old 02-11-2018, 06:24 PM   #11
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You really should be asking this question on Calguns, because there's so much about the recently enacted laws that even the wise legal greybeards can't agree on.

Since we're past the window to make a new "Assault Weapon" per CA, you'd have to use a fixed magazine to keep your "evil features". (tl;dr: magazine cannot be removed without disabling the action; there are threads on Calguns that discuss ways to do this on an AK pattern rifle. It ain't pretty...)

Re: side folding stock, its even worse than what OCRebote78 said. Because of bad case law, CA DOJ measures a rifle in its shortest configuration, rather than the federal standard longest. And its not just 26"! If you're under 30" OAL with a semi-auto centerfire in its shortest configuration, you've got an illegal AW.
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Old 02-11-2018, 06:47 PM   #12
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Okay, so: Pin folding stock open. Pin mag to rec. Remove forward pistol grip. Pin barrel ext to 16.25. Request serial # from DOJ. Other option: Register as SBR in California where one must show good cause for a short barrel rifle and since there's no pending zombie invasion, they'll likely deny request. Or move to another state, is that about right?

Last edited by zulu don; 02-11-2018 at 06:55 PM.
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Old 02-11-2018, 07:00 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by zulu don View Post
Okay, so: Pin folding stock open. Pin mag to rec. Remove forward pistol grip. Pin barrel ext to 16.25. Request serial # from DOJ. Other option: Register as SBR in California where one must show good cause for a short barrel rifle and since there's no pending zombie invasion, they'll likely deny my request. Or move to another state, is that about right?
There is 0 to NO chance California allows you to register and SBR.
The only remote chance you have is if it were a C&R originally which your AMD is not.

If you pin the folding stock, do not install the forward grip, and add a grip wrap, then you do not have to register as an "assault weapon" as it would be featureless rifle. Make sure to either use a muzzle break (not a flash hider) or a thread protector. This way, you can still have a detachable mag as well.
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Old 02-11-2018, 07:02 PM   #14
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SBR is out of the question for mere mortals, and RAW window is closed for new builds. But as long as its fixed magazine and avoids any other AW landmines, you can keep the dong. If you were going to go featureless, you'd have to remove the dong to be safe.

There's a lot of claims both ways about the serial number.

For sure, after 7/1/18 you will have to apply to CA DOJ for an assigned serial number.

Alternately, you can engrave your personal manufacturering information on the receiver per federal standards (as if you were going to FFL transfer to a new owner) and avoid having to apply for the S/N via CA DOJ before 7/1/18. The problem is no one knows for sure: bare reading of the law implies this, but others claim a home builder doesn't qualify as a "manufacturer".

Or move to another state.
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Old 02-11-2018, 07:17 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by zulu don View Post
Okay, so: Pin folding stock open. Pin mag to rec. Remove forward pistol grip. Pin barrel ext to 16.25. Request serial # from DOJ. Other option: Register as SBR in California where one must show good cause for a short barrel rifle and since there's no pending zombie invasion, they'll likely deny request. Or move to another state, is that about right?
AMD65 stock is easy to fix open. Unscrew the push-button at bottom of reciever. Insert properly sized washer. Screw button back in. Done

There is sticky on Calguns in the gunsmithing section, on how to fix all AK stocks
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Old 02-11-2018, 09:58 PM   #16
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I have a amd 65 in here in ca. I “fixed” the stock in the open position and pulled the front grip then added the horrific grip wing to make it featureless... I mark my home builds with a serial number and build location. I’d rather have somthing on the gun than nothing if I got pulled over.
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Old 02-11-2018, 11:41 PM   #17
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I dont mind the grip wrap. Beats the shit out of a fixed mag.
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Old 02-12-2018, 05:58 AM   #18
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Fix muzzle brake, fix folding stock, fin grip rear p/g and remove foward grip = no neexfo register
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Old 02-12-2018, 08:37 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by adam6955 View Post
I dont mind the grip wrap. Beats the shit out of a fixed mag.
+1


Better than fixed mag for sure.
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Old 02-12-2018, 11:37 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Oldmandan View Post
Not sure where you heard this, but its incorrect.

The new law requires that builders apply for serial #’s with the CA-DOJ. The new number must be engraved within 10 days of the built firearm. This new law does not start until 7/1/18

The forward grip on AK’s kinda out there in limbo in regards to legality. A letter was released by the ATF a few years back stating that forward grips like the AMD65 were considered just “factory handguards” by the ATF. This is obviously opposite of what CA-DOJ thinks. So you’re kinda taking your chances with the LEO you may meet on any given day, in regards to compliance...

Personally, my AMD65 and AKM63 don’t have the forward grips on them, since Im not willing to bet any future LEO’s that may see them know whats legal or not. I still own the stock forward grips, as CA does not have a constructive possesion law.
Unless you happen to be that guy from Chico with the 23 Aw's and the dreaded "parts kits"....
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Old 02-13-2018, 02:47 AM   #21
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Don't register. Go featureless.

Better to have a shitty looking pistol grip and none folding stock than a retarded fixed 10 rd mag.

Join Calguns. Most up to date info can be found there regarding these bastard laws.
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Old 02-13-2018, 06:02 AM   #22
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Fool you trippin.

Keep the wood AK stock and get a kydex grip wrap. Run a muzzle nut or slant brake. Ditch the AMD reverse forward pistol grip for some wood.

'Ta bien.
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Old 02-13-2018, 06:22 AM   #23
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can an ak even be top loaded with a fixed mag?
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Old 02-13-2018, 10:48 AM   #24
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can an ak even be top loaded with a fixed mag?
Not even worth finding out.
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Old 02-13-2018, 04:43 PM   #25
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can an ak even be top loaded with a fixed mag?
I've done it trying to figure out fixed mag options for pistol builds, it sucks balls but its possible. I decided to sell the build rather than cuck it down to that level. Too cumbersome and possibly even dangerous.
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Old 02-13-2018, 06:54 PM   #26
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Too cumbersome and possibly even dangerous.
that is the problem, these states keep adding rules to make the public safer but put gun users in danger. for example featureless lets the user not have a solid firm grip for control.

op get a gripwrap, washer on the folder to keep it open, and call it good.
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Old 02-13-2018, 11:12 PM   #27
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Never had any problem with lack of control on a featureless build. Still hate it, but fixed mags suck ass...even on an AR.
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Old 02-14-2018, 06:25 PM   #28
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Never had any problem with lack of control on a featureless build. Still hate it, but fixed mags suck ass...even on an AR.
+1
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