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Old 06-14-2018, 07:17 AM   #36
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Originally Posted by John A. View Post
I own 2 shockwave blades.

Neither came with a strap.

True story.
Haha very good advice. OP listen to this!
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Old 06-14-2018, 10:01 AM   #37
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I own 2 shockwave blades.

Neither came with a strap.

True story.
Same, last I checked Shockwave Blades didnt even come with straps...
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Old 06-15-2018, 12:40 PM   #38
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I heard that the over all length has to be under 26" when installing a KAK blade or would be considered a SBR...Y/N?

I also heard if you plug the hole at the tube end, its considered a modification....making the KAK blade illegal. Y/N?

I heard too, the BATF ruled its OK to shoulder the KAK blade, as long as its not done consistently. Y/N?
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Old 06-15-2018, 12:41 PM   #39
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I heard that the over all length has to be under 26" when installing a KAK or would be considered a SBR...Y/N?

I also heard if you plug the hole at the tube end, its considered a modification....making the KAK illegal. Y/N?
You have obviously been listening to the south end of a bull.
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Old 06-15-2018, 02:27 PM   #40
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Lmfao as long as it's not done consistently? Scouts honor, I only shouldered it like 5 times. I swear. Gimme a break.
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Old 06-15-2018, 04:41 PM   #41
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I've read that keeping the length of pull below 12.5" is G2G. Dunno what sort of truth there is to that.

I wouldn't plug the end. The ATF has a good reputation for changing things when it suits them and for akibg rulings on a whim.
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Old 06-15-2018, 04:51 PM   #42
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I've read that keeping the length of pull below 12.5" is G2G. Dunno what sort of truth there is to that.
Did you read it from the U.S. Code or some ATF "ruling"?

If not, you also should not stand so close to the south end of a bull.



This bullshit is how we screw ourselves ( someone posting some half-baked bullshit & guys like you passing it on )
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Old 06-15-2018, 05:50 PM   #43
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ATF commented on the 12.5" ruling to one of the blade manufacturers. I've read that with my own eyes too. It's not Deerhurst who's screwing anyone. If you're going to blame someone, at least put the blame where it belongs.
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Old 06-15-2018, 06:30 PM   #44
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ATF commented on the 12.5" ruling to one of the blade manufacturers. I've read that with my own eyes too. It's not Deerhurst who's screwing anyone. If you're going to blame someone, at least put the blame where it belongs.
Got a link?

Was this "comment" included in their "official publications" on pistol braces.



Sorry, gettin' tired of regular folks touring Washington DC and when they're in the ATF building taking a whiz, they hear a fart from one of the stalls that sounds like an opinion and come running back to the boards to share it with everyone . . .
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Old 06-15-2018, 07:45 PM   #45
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I can link you to stories about people who have been struck with pieces of a meteorite. Can anyone link me to a story where somebody went to jail just because they modified their shockwave blade?

So do you guys walk around worried about meteor strikes, something that actually happens? I chalk this up right there with worrying about 922r.
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Old 06-15-2018, 10:07 PM   #46
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Got a link?
Yeah, I'll look up the link for you.


http://shockwavetechnologies.com/site/?p=3524
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Old 06-15-2018, 10:15 PM   #47
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Yeah, I'll look up the link for you.


http://shockwavetechnologies.com/site/?p=3524
Clear as mud.

So - according to that "guidance" - I can have a 16" arm brace if I never shoulder it?


You'll pardon me if I want to see the "law" in the U.S. Code or an official publication from the revenuers ( not paraphrased on some vendor's site )
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Old 06-15-2018, 11:17 PM   #48
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13 9/16 lop
Canis adapter and mod 2 @ full extension

0 fucks given
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Old 06-15-2018, 11:21 PM   #49
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If "shouldering a brace redefines it as a stock".. Like using a crescent wrench as a hammer(does not make it a hammer but by their logic(lol) it does....

Does that mean we can install stocks with straps and "redefine" them as braces?
Could get a strap through sling points on a ctr. ..
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Old 06-15-2018, 11:37 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by nalioth View Post
Did you read it from the U.S. Code or some ATF "ruling"?

If not, you also should not stand so close to the south end of a bull.



This bullshit is how we screw ourselves ( someone posting some half-baked bullshit & guys like you passing it on )


Before you get on your high horse and be an asshole to someone, no matter who they are or where they are, you should do some research.


The wording comes from KAK themselves. Takes about 2 seconds to find with a google search.

My comfortable LOP with my loadout is around 12 inches anyway. I am not a big dude.


MIG, that's where we get the crescent hammer! It is a glorious hybrid tool to fix any job!
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Old 06-16-2018, 09:25 AM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MIG*7.62 View Post
If "shouldering a brace redefines it as a stock".. Like using a crescent wrench as a hammer(does not make it a hammer but by their logic(lol) it does....

Does that mean we can install stocks with straps and "redefine" them as braces?
Could get a strap through sling points on a ctr. ..
Well a crescent wrench can also be used as a nut lathe to take those pesky high spots down on the hex. So yeah it makes no sense.


Pretty much as follows... ATF- we are the fed, we make the rules, we are not accountable, welcome to the party pal.
Just like any other fed agency. They can screw you if they want to. Maybe the trick is not looking like a screw, but they can still get you for anything, anywhere, and at any time. If they want to.
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Old 06-16-2018, 03:11 PM   #52
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Nut lath

That's a good one, gonna havta remember that lol
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Old 06-16-2018, 05:08 PM   #53
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Well a crescent wrench can also be used as a nut lathe to take those pesky high spots down on the hex.
The terminology Ďround my parts is a mexican speedwrench.
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Old 06-16-2018, 09:27 PM   #54
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just stop all yalll bitching and read letter of ATF regarding ANY arm brace


https://www.atf.gov/file/11816/download
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Old 06-17-2018, 06:51 AM   #55
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just stop all yalll bitching and read letter of ATF regarding ANY arm brace


https://www.atf.gov/file/11816/download
Seems pretty clear to me.
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Old 06-17-2018, 10:50 AM   #56
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so its now illegal to shoulder a brace? wtf?
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Old 06-17-2018, 12:11 PM   #57
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so its now illegal to shoulder a brace? wtf?
It never was legal to intentionally shoulder a brace. There was no ambiguity about the subject. The hundreds that film themselves doing so on YT etc. and say it’s legal to do so now are sadly mistaken and not very wise IMO. Otherwise there would be zero reason to SBR anything. Which would also mean legally you no longer need to file an F1 and pay a tax. That is not going to happen.
They have stated that inadvertent contact with ones shoulder is not felonious but that means if while shooting and the brace is against your cheek and recoil causes it to slip and unintentionally assumes the position one would with a stocked rifle .ie shoulder contact, that is permissible but substituting a brace as a buttstock, which is entirely possible and functional is not permitted.
Moronic yes, unenforceable, yes unless it’s on video but that is ATF position.
Plain and simple.
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Old 06-18-2018, 02:22 PM   #58
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Here is the most recent ATF letter regarding the issue. Dated 3/21/2017

https://www.sigsauer.com/wp-content/...ch-21-2017.pdf
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Old 06-18-2018, 06:05 PM   #59
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:-/
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Old 06-22-2018, 12:06 AM   #60
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Here is the most recent ATF letter regarding the issue. Dated 3/21/2017

https://www.sigsauer.com/wp-content/...ch-21-2017.pdf
some manufacture's need to stfu and leave well enough alone
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Old 06-22-2018, 04:15 PM   #61
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Use that is "incidental, sporadic, or situational" does not constitute a redesign. This is from the 2017 letter linked to above.

"Situational" use seems contemplated to be limited, but its less clear to me than "incidental or sporadic."

off the top of my head I'm thinking something like you are shooting in the rain or snow and keep losing your cheekweld so the Brace is bouncing into your shoulder EVERY time. Once dry, this stops happening for example.

However, similar to ddnc, I have a hard time believing that ATF meant to include every normal range session where you line up as usual and shoulder from start to finish.

The specific language is meant to convey a limitation on the use of a Brace
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Old 06-22-2018, 05:19 PM   #62
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Use that is "incidental, sporadic, or situational" does not constitute a redesign. This is from the 2017 letter linked to above.

"Situational" use seems contemplated to be limited, but its less clear to me than "incidental or sporadic."

off the top of my head I'm thinking something like you are shooting in the rain or snow and keep losing your cheekweld so the Brace is bouncing into your shoulder EVERY time. Once dry, this stops happening for example.

However, similar to ddnc, I have a hard time believing that ATF meant to include every normal range session where you line up as usual and shoulder from start to finish.

The specific language is meant to convey a limitation on the use of a Brace
Situational could mean that you have to shoulder for whatever reason, thick jacket, close quarters, handed it to a short armed kid, who knows. Incidental and sporadic kind of spell things out pretty clearly IMHO.

Iíd almost bet that one day a prominent YouTube personality will become a test case. I know I donít want to be the case.
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Old 06-22-2018, 05:32 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rev06 View Post
Use that is "incidental, sporadic, or situational" does not constitute a redesign. This is from the 2017 letter linked to above.

"Situational" use seems contemplated to be limited, but its less clear to me than "incidental or sporadic."

off the top of my head I'm thinking something like you are shooting in the rain or snow and keep losing your cheekweld so the Brace is bouncing into your shoulder EVERY time. Once dry, this stops happening for example.

However, similar to ddnc, I have a hard time believing that ATF meant to include every normal range session where you line up as usual and shoulder from start to finish.

The specific language is meant to convey a limitation on the use of a Brace
Make sure you have tons of photos of you using the strapped brace on your forearm and NONE of you with the pistol on your shoulder.
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Old 06-22-2018, 06:23 PM   #64
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Make sure you have tons of photos of you using the strapped brace on your forearm and NONE of you with the pistol on your shoulder.
Give that advice to a bunch of video makers will ya dave.

People give Atlantic guff when they post pictures of cheeked braces, but legally theyíre in the right, the others are not. Everyone running around mis-using braces will give the batty boys cause to redetermine braces as nothing more than stocks
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