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Old 04-12-2019, 11:27 PM   #1
ChilLyWilLy
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Default Zenith Z series issues??

This thread started in the Atlantic Firearms forum and it kind of ballooned so I'm just starting a new thread under pistols.

Link to what we started. http://www.akfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=331167

Anyways, both my Zenith Z-5rs and Z-5p have 3 lug fitment issues using my SilencerCo Omega9k. I've try 2 differenent 3 lug mounts, SilencerCo's short 3lug mount and the Rugged 3lug mount.

At first the 9k had issues getting pushed down on the 3lug muzzle. After taking it on and off over 20 times this smoothed over.

My next issue after this is trying to turn the 9k AFTER I push down. I called Zenith to see what the Warranty Customer Service people would say. They told me to sand down the paint on the 3lug muzzle.

I have sanded down the face and surrounding paint from each lug and I am still unable to turn the suppressor into the locked position. So now my Z-5rs's muzzle has a well worn look with no functionality with 3lug mounts. I am unwilling to try to sand down the Z5p to attempt the same. I have contacted Zenith via email to try to get an RMA number because this is a spec issue now not paint.

Has anybody else with new batch Zeniths had my issues. BTW, my paint is even and looks good, my mags have slight wobble but position of mags do not effect bolt closure. I have no other issues with my pistols except the damn 3lug. I have a CZ Scorpion that has HK specced 3 lug adapter from HKParts.com and it fits perfect.

Last edited by ChilLyWilLy; 04-13-2019 at 01:45 PM. Reason: Spelling derp.
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Old 04-13-2019, 09:53 AM   #2
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I think an RMA is in order. I was able to mount my Liberty Mystic and its 3 lug adapter on my RS without issue also, and I did not have to even touch the paint on the RS barrel. I have the same adapter as you on my EVO that works fine with that setup also.

Just as another test, do you have access to any other 3 lug accessories, like a flash hider?
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Old 04-13-2019, 10:44 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by esh21167 View Post
I think an RMA is in order. I was able to mount my Liberty Mystic and its 3 lug adapter on my RS without issue also, and I did not have to even touch the paint on the RS barrel. I have the same adapter as you on my EVO that works fine with that setup also.

Just as another test, do you have access to any other 3 lug accessories, like a flash hider?
No, just 2 kinds of 3 lug mounts. 1 SilencerCo short mount and 1 Rugged Suppressors mount.
I'm really unsure about wth is going on so I'm RMAing. Like you said, HK specced 3lug works perfect on my EVO as well, only other 3lug gun I have besides the 2 Zeniths.
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Old 04-13-2019, 12:40 PM   #4
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It sucks to hear so many problems out of this latest shipment. I can't believe they told you to sand the 3 lug down. They should replace the barrel and refinish the gun for you IMO on a 1,800.00 gun.
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Old 04-13-2019, 01:51 PM   #5
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It sucks to hear so many problems out of this latest shipment. I can't believe they told you to sand the 3 lug down. They should replace the barrel and refinish the gun for you IMO on a 1,800.00 gun.
Yeah man. I'm irked. The guns look sexy as fuck but they should know, if somebody has a gun budget that can afford these things, it is a good possibility that a suppressor owner is going to be in the mix. TEST YOUR DAMN 3 LUG FUCTUONALITY!!!
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Old 04-13-2019, 08:15 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by HKaltwasser View Post
It sucks to hear so many problems out of this latest shipment. I can't believe they told you to sand the 3 lug down. They should replace the barrel and refinish the gun for you IMO on a 1,800.00 gun.
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Originally Posted by ChilLyWilLy View Post
Yeah man. I'm irked. The guns look sexy as fuck but they should know, if somebody has a gun budget that can afford these things, it is a good possibility that a suppressor owner is going to be in the mix. TEST YOUR DAMN 3 LUG FUCTUONALITY!!!
I'm sure Zenith with take care of the problem, though I think most agree that this latest shipment has had more issues than in the past. As far as sanding, since the finish is paint, it's very possible for a little extra paint to affect the 3 lug. I believe the tolerance on that is pretty tight, like .0005-.001". I suspect they will replace the barrel.

For once I guess I was lucky. Some failures during the first 250 or so rounds. Need to run some more full power ammo through it for the break in period.
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Old 04-13-2019, 09:22 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by esh21167 View Post
I'm sure Zenith with take care of the problem, though I think most agree that this latest shipment has had more issues than in the past. As far as sanding, since the finish is paint, it's very possible for a little extra paint to affect the 3 lug. I believe the tolerance on that is pretty tight, like .0005-.001". I suspect they will replace the barrel.

For once I guess I was lucky. Some failures during the first 250 or so rounds. Need to run some more full power ammo through it for the break in period.
I hear a lot of people run 124 gr NATO for at least 200 and up to 500 for full break in.
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Old 04-14-2019, 09:08 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by ChilLyWilLy View Post
I hear a lot of people run 124 gr NATO for at least 200 and up to 500 for full break in.
Yeah, I have to get some more of that. Maybe some of that GECO 124 gr. Not labeled NATO, but the specs put it right up there.
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Old 04-14-2019, 08:11 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by esh21167 View Post
I'm sure Zenith with take care of the problem, though I think most agree that this latest shipment has had more issues than in the past. As far as sanding, since the finish is paint, it's very possible for a little extra paint to affect the 3 lug. I believe the tolerance on that is pretty tight, like .0005-.001". I suspect they will replace the barrel.

For once I guess I was lucky. Some failures during the first 250 or so rounds. Need to run some more full power ammo through it for the break in period.
Yeah, I got that. It's just that sanding it either changes the finish or removes it. I know being a 3 lug it's going to happen some down the line but to ask for someone to do it right out of the gate kind of stinks.

I'm hoping this run was a rushed fluke and their next shipment will have better QC as I plan on getting one. I don't wanna replace the barrel on my K with a 3 lug, it will find of defeat the compact purpose of the gun.
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Old 04-15-2019, 12:29 AM   #10
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I ran about 180 through my pistol MP5 full size on Saturday. Two minor issues to load from one of the MKE/Zenith (Turkey) mags which are really tight. The German mags ran fine. My magwell is very tight. Otherwise, all ammo ran fine (115gr). Accurate and easy to shoot, Range officer enjoyed a few rounds as well. I love mine and highly recommend in my experience. AR15.com has a thread with issues going on with a few guns.





Zenith Mags - appear to be parked
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Old 04-15-2019, 11:27 PM   #11
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My mags load a little "rough" as well, I think that is what your saying. I'm going to let some clp sit on the outside and wipe it down when I shoot it.

Also an update from Zenith. An armorer emailed me and told me I had to take the paint off from the neck ABOVE the lugs. I have done this and my suppressor still will not turn all the way and lock, I have a small amount of give when it comes to turning it but it will not turn past the actual lugs. So right now I have sanded down all the paint on the lugs AND the neck on my Z-5rs and have sanded down just the neck on my Z-5p, still no lock up. I am hoping to get an RMA number and shipping info tomorrow.

I'm also going to try and find a shop in my city with suppressors and hopefully they have other 3 lug mounts for me to trouble shoot. I really don't want to buy a bunch of mounts just to try since I know my suppressor works with an HK specced 3 lug barrel/adapter already.

Last edited by ChilLyWilLy; 04-16-2019 at 02:03 AM.
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Old 04-16-2019, 01:39 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChilLyWilLy View Post
My mags load a little "rough" as well, I think that is what your saying. I'm going to let some clp sit on the outside and wipe it down when I shoot it.

Also an update from Zenith. An armored emailed me and told me I had to take the paint off from the neck ABOVE the lungs. I have done this and my suppressor still will not turn all the way and lock, I have a small amount of give when it comes to turning it but it will not turn past the actual lugs. So right now I have sanded down all the paint on the lugs AND the neck on my Z'5rs and have sanded down just the neck on my Z-5p. I am hoping to get an RMA number and shipping info tomorrow.

I'm also going to try and find a shop in my city with suppressors and hopefully they have other 3 lug mounts for me to trouble shoot. I really don't want to buy a bunch of mounts just to try since I know my suppressor works with an HK specced 3 lug barrel/adapter already.
Hope everything works out with your suppressors Bruddah.. Although I don’t plan on running suppressors on any of my Zenith’s anytime soon. Just by looking at my Z-5P’s 3 lug mount, it looks to me that the paint is pretty thick.

That would be a good thing if I don’t plan to use a suppressor on the 3 mount lug. But, I’m sure that I’ll run into that same problem if ever I do plan to use the 3 mount lug.
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Old 04-16-2019, 03:53 AM   #13
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Unfortunately, my cans are currently in NFA jail but have a pair of Rugged Obsidian 3 lug mounts in anticipation. Will I be able to tell if I run into the same problem by sliding the mounts on?
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Old 04-16-2019, 04:25 AM   #14
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Unfortunately, my cans are currently in NFA jail but have a pair of Rugged Obsidian 3 lug mounts in anticipation. Will I be able to tell if I run into the same problem by sliding the mounts on?
What a coincidence, I had a breakthrough tonite. After working my Silencerco Omega9k with "flush" 3lug mount on and off over 50 times I tried the Rugged 3 lug mount. It fucking works!!!! The Silencerco FLUSH 3 lug mount doesn't work yet but at least the Rugged 3 lug works. I'm going to run NATO through it today or tomorrow and see what happens. My arm hurts so fucking bad from pushing and twisting... ugh

Oh. And to answer your question, yes. Just send the gun to the FFL with your suppressor and try it out man. If your trying to say using JUST the mount I'm unsure.

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Old 04-20-2019, 06:51 AM   #15
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I had the magwell issue on my Z-5RS where I couldn't insert a magazine. I sent it back in to Zenith last week and just got it back yesterday with a 6 business day turnaround. The magwell now looks straight and is nice and tight. Impressed with their customer service along the way.

I also contacted Jen to request a subgun subforum so hopefully that will be something that can be done.
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Old 04-20-2019, 09:01 AM   #16
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Recently I have been looking at 9mm Sub Gun PDW's, and the Zenith 5RS is the one I would go with as it has the optimal barrel length of 8 inches. Zenith 5P is another that I would accept after the 5RS. There are a couple of places that still carry both for sale even as of today, although I actually think that the majority of the last ship load was bought up like at a fire sale. I do have two actual H&K rifles, HK in .308 and in 5.56, both pre Ban, as I purchased them in the early 1980's.
The prices for these Zenith offerings are actually very good. The two HK rifles which are also roller blocked internally, cost me about $750 each back when I purchased them. The 9mm MP5's were probably similar at the time.
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Old 04-20-2019, 09:42 AM   #17
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^Where are you seeing 5P's available?
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Old 04-21-2019, 03:30 AM   #18
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^Where are you seeing 5P's available?
They pop up in Gunbroker every once in awhile. Itís usually a LGS somewhere thatís selling them.
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Old 04-21-2019, 08:51 AM   #19
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Update on my RS:
First run of about 300 rounds on my RS last weekend. About 2-3 failures to eject/feed per mag, jams using ZQI 124r gr NATO (remember that stuff?). A little better with the 147 gr Lawman, both unsuppressed and suppressed.

Yesterday, I ran another 250 of the ZQI NATO. It still had about a 2-4 failures per mag. One time, just a click. I pulled back the charging handle and saw an empty chamber. Pulled the mag, cycled the charging handle a few times. Reinserted mag and a round chambered. 'Click'. Repeated a few times. Dropped the trigger housing and there was an empty case inside the trigger housing down in front of the hammer. What the heck?

Got through that 250 rounds and had 2-3 per mag or so not ejecting, jamming the next round in with the spent case. For the heck of it, I ran some cheap Magtech 115 gr. next. 6 mags and only one failure on the second mag.

So maybe that ZQI NATO is crap in this gun. I have no more and it's out of production, so no great loss there. 115 gr is cheaper than 124 gr anyway. Didn't run any 147 gr Lawman today. That will be my next test, since I now feel pretty good about 115 gr. I'll be very disappointed if I can't get the Lawman to function, especially suppressed.
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Old 04-21-2019, 10:44 AM   #20
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I have no first with the Zenith Z series, but I do have first hand experience with Zenith customer support and warranty repairs for another product line.

Based upon my experience I would stay as far away as I could from Zenith.

Just my opinion, your mileage may vary.
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Old 04-21-2019, 10:46 AM   #21
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Hope you figure it out esh, Winchester NATO was perfect for me. As far as suppression, I want to run 147gr American Eagle to see if that will run since it has a flat nose, short neck. Anyways, GL man.
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Old 04-21-2019, 09:13 PM   #22
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Some more 115 gr. today and zero issues. 5 mags of Lawman 147 gr suppressed. One POF mag had multiple failures, but other POF mags and the MKE mags ran fine. My conclusion is that mag has an issue. Overall, I guess it's settling in. A little gas in the face, but not nearly as bad as with the AE 147 gr. After struggling through a few mags of that last week, I actually had a small black streak across my forehead.
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Old 05-08-2019, 11:03 PM   #23
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Just got notification that my Z-5RS is in. Calling to pay tomorrow and it will be on it's way to my FFL.

I ordered under Zenith's "Hero Program" , but the the discount doesn't seem to be much at all. Just hope mine has no problems.
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Old 05-09-2019, 12:43 AM   #24
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Just got notification that my Z-5RS is in. Calling to pay tomorrow and it will be on it's way to my FFL.

I ordered under Zenith's "Hero Program" , but the the discount doesn't seem to be much at all. Just hope mine has no problems.
Hell yeah! You'll LOVE the Z-5RS... Mine shoots freakin smooth as butter! Don't forget to post pictures in here: http://www.akfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=377688

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Old 05-09-2019, 04:05 PM   #25
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i will be running mine primarily suppressed. Does it have both threaded and 3 lug options?
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I often wonder whether we do not rest our hopes too much upon constitutions, upon laws and upon courts... Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can even do much to help it.
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Old 05-09-2019, 06:01 PM   #26
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i will be running mine primarily suppressed. Does it have both threaded and 3 lug options?
Yes indeed, the Z-5RS do have those options if you want to run a threaded or 3 lug suppressor.
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Old 05-09-2019, 06:20 PM   #27
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I have a Ti-Rant 9 and a Griffin Optimus. The optimus offeres a optional 3 lug adapter I'll have to try out.
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I often wonder whether we do not rest our hopes too much upon constitutions, upon laws and upon courts... Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can even do much to help it.
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Old 05-13-2019, 10:37 AM   #28
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Just called and paid for my Z-5RS!

There are 71 pistols coming in, and 253 people on the waiting list according to Chase.
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Originally Posted by Judge Learned Hand
I often wonder whether we do not rest our hopes too much upon constitutions, upon laws and upon courts... Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can even do much to help it.
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Old 05-13-2019, 11:13 AM   #29
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Just called and paid for my Z-5RS!

There are 71 pistols coming in, and 253 people on the waiting list according to Chase.
Did you buy directly from Zenith? Let's move the conversation here: http://www.akfiles.com/forums/showth...=377688&page=2
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Old 05-13-2019, 11:50 AM   #30
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The fitment issue has been known long before the last shipment came in. The end of the barrel should only be parked, with no finish over that. Then I suppose people would complain about the look of that too.

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