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Old 07-10-2005, 09:34 AM   #1
m1a convert
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Default Bolt Cutters Grinding

When you start grinding the boltcutters I am sure the heat builds up rather quickly. I believe I saw on Pookies site that his first pair broke. How do you grind them so that they don't heat up and become brittle? Or is this even a problem?
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Old 07-10-2005, 10:21 AM   #2
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You have to get a grinder like mine,,, Grind for one second, stop and let the RPM's build up again, grind for 1 second, stop and let rpm's come up, grind for 1 second,,,,,etc, etc. Mine never got a chance to heat up!


But it took forever!


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Old 07-10-2005, 10:43 AM   #3
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When I did mine I would grind for a few seconds then dip in water, then grind for a few seconds then dip in water. Worked fine for me. Then I bought a sweet set from CWToyota.
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Old 07-10-2005, 12:15 PM   #4
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When the metal starts to change color at the grind line you are affecting the heat treatment. During the first "hog some metal off" stage you will be grinding this area away anyway so you can go longer between water dips. As you progress to the later fine tuning stage you want *no* color change. By this time you will have figured out how many seconds you can hold the steel to the wheel before it starts to heat up too much and can cool it off at that point.

IMHO, I think some of these modified boltcutters break because they are cheap made in China tools. Mine started out life as a $10-12 tent sale special. My other set that I actually use as boltcutters are a SNAP-ON set that cost $130. Guess which one has the better steel and heat treatment.
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Old 07-10-2005, 01:57 PM   #5
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the chinese ones?........we all know harbor frieght makes 1 use tools for most of its stuff thats why the bolt cutters are breaking
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Old 07-10-2005, 04:35 PM   #6
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Just cut up a pair of Chinese 24" bolt cutters from Home Depot. I used my Dremel with the heavy duty cut-off disks and a couple hand files. I stopped cutting whenever the part got too warm to be comfortable to touch. I didn't want to affect the temper of the metal. In some of the pictures on the web of cutters, they look pretty toasted. Took a little while, but looks decent and they crushed a couple practice rivets just fine. Used 6 or 7, maybe 8 ?, of the Dremel cut-off discs. The length of the blades on the 24" are nearly perfect to reach the middle rivets. It would have required grinding a lot out of the crosspieces to use the shorter bolt cutters Home Depot had. The 24" only cost $ 5 more.
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Old 07-10-2005, 05:21 PM   #7
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Let's hope a $120 Snap-On pair of cutters is made better than a $4 HF special! If not, that Snap-On man sure is pulling one over on everyone. I don't think it's the cheap "chinese metal" as much as it is taking too much metal away or putting stress on the jaws where it shouldn't be. My greenlightarms version is A+ quality and I doubt it would ever break because it's *designed* right--out of the cheap "chinese metal". Most of the homemade cutters I see look like they're missing way too much metal.


Quote:
Originally Posted by KernelKrink
IMHO, I think some of these modified boltcutters break because they are cheap made in China tools. Mine started out life as a $10-12 tent sale special. My other set that I actually use as boltcutters are a SNAP-ON set that cost $130. Guess which one has the better steel and heat treatment.
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Old 07-11-2005, 07:23 AM   #8
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If you think just because it say's "snap-on"..."Mac"..etc. that it is a good tool---looks like you have fallen for the marketing "hype" also!...LOL....


..Sure "some" of the stuff is very good equipment/tools, but the majority anymore are simply repackaged junk that is made in china/japan/mexico......The tool game has changed dramatically in the last 10 years or so------The good old tool companies are now run by "Bean counters" trying to impress stock holders...This equals bait and switch bull shit that would scare you royaly!........Many of the import items are repacked by small out-source companies in the attractive "brand" packaging to make you think it was a quality US tool--when in actuality you had a US package with a absolute garbage POS tool inside!.....Sure they will warrante it for you--heck this import tool costs about 10% of the high quality US made tool!....

You want to learn a LOT about a companies inside BS...try this link!...

WOW..e-nuff-said!

www.stanleysucks.com
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Old 07-11-2005, 09:22 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boltactionsforever
If you think just because it say's "snap-on"..."Mac"..etc. that it is a good tool---looks like you have fallen for the marketing "hype" also!...LOL....
Now have you actually used a Snap-On tool or are you just going by what someone else has said? There's a reason why just about every mechanic pays mega $$$ for such tools--because when time is against you and you can't have a tool to break, you buy a tool that most likely won't break when others would. I don't own one single Snap-On tool, most of the tools I work on cars and motorcycles with is Craftsman and the gun stuff is Harbor Freight. If you actually put your tools to the limit, you'll find that the big $$$ tools are better. But us non-mechanics don't need high dollar tools because we can afford the time of the rare tool breakage.

Quote:
Originally Posted by boltactionsforever
..Sure "some" of the stuff is very good equipment/tools, but the majority anymore are simply repackaged junk that is made in china/japan/mexico......The tool game has changed dramatically in the last 10 years or so------The good old tool companies are now run by "Bean counters" trying to impress stock holders...This equals bait and switch bull shit that would scare you royaly!........Many of the import items are repacked by small out-source companies in the attractive "brand" packaging to make you think it was a quality US tool--when in actuality you had a US package with a absolute garbage POS tool inside!.....Sure they will warrante it for you--heck this import tool costs about 10% of the high quality US made tool!....
Honestly, I don't believe one word in this paragraph. It's common knowledge that if you're buying cheap tools, they're not forged in the US and have no US materials, but beyond that I think it's a mix of common knowledge and scaremongering.

I have a friend who made a similar site about Comcast. From my experience, people who start a hate site (esp. with the word "sucks" in the URL) aren't exactly in the know...

Sorry to threadjack and argue about something like tools.
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Old 07-11-2005, 11:43 AM   #10
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I wonder why so many people think someone posting has zero experiance with what there saying in a posting???...wow, Ok---I can justify your reply....


Now that you seem to disagree with someone that has spent there entire life with wrench's...you need to do a little research for yourself....

Hummm...14 years as a ASE master mechanic....yes before I was a tool dealer---own many many snap-on/mac/matco tools....And DONT own craftsman tools--sorry home owners!

10 more years as a top 100 tool dealer for one of the big three...yep definately does'nt give me very much experiance does it....

2 more years as a service manager of a large facility-----

you may want to rethink your posting....

my homework has been done....and if you READ within the "hate site" as you call it---you will see SEVERAL law suits about the issue at hand---quality--and deception......It's a game that is being carried out on America--believe it or follow the flocks'..just remember I told you so...


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Old 07-11-2005, 12:03 PM   #11
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Well, you do have the experience, I had no way of knowing beforehand. And like I said, I'm going on my experiences which really vary from yours. I have no comeback to your post, you gave your experience and your experiences and I can't argue that. I'm not on either side honestly, I could care less about expensive tools, I was just explaining why they're worth it to some people. I truly didn't mean to get you worked up.
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Old 07-11-2005, 07:42 PM   #12
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I have also been wrenching professionaly for about 20 years or so now, so I do know the difference between a quality tool and a cheap one. The Snap-On set is definitely much higher quality than the $12 imported ones. Little things like the lack of flex in the handles when using them tend to make me think the Snap-On are heavier duty than the tent sale models. That, and the lack of dents in the cutters after using them.
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Old 07-14-2005, 09:10 AM   #13
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getting ready to modify bolt cutters for rivets. would it be possible to use a bandsaw to cut and lessen heat build up
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Old 07-16-2005, 03:37 PM   #14
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On the snap on tools...

I work for a large railroad that exclusively used snap on.

Well they don't anymore for the exception of some specialized railroad tools.

Getting snap-on to exchange a broken tool (yes they do break) was like asking for a miracle.

And at $256 for a plain 3/8 drive 16 piece socket set it was costing too damn much. The ratchet fell apart after 2 uses the internals lost. Yeah snap on sent the replacement 'guts' for the ratchet (couldn't even send a complete ratchet) and we received it a whole 2 weeks later....snap on is way over rated. BTW their flat tip screw drivers are absolute crap. The ends are too narrow and they bend too easy when actually using them for what they are for (tightening/loosening screws). Snap on has changed. I like kobalt and klein tools.
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Old 07-17-2005, 09:38 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bighad
getting ready to modify bolt cutters for rivets. would it be possible to use a bandsaw to cut and lessen heat build up
Don't be worried about over heating the cutters. I ground mine a little at a time, dunked the jaws in water every so often. The jaws never got too hot to touch even before dunking. Just go slow.

One thing I learned: Grind the cutter portion first. Grind until the cutters will allow the proper spacing for your rivet + backing plate. Proper spacing means, handles together, jaws about the right distance apart for a properly squashed rivet, and flats on the jaws parallel at the closed position. After the inside is ground, take off just enough of the outside to fit in the trunnion hole. I started with the outside first and took off too much metal. I could have left a lot more and made the jaws stronger. I was able to get to the farthest back rivet from the front of the trunnion. The bottom rivet can be gotten from the mag well. Pookie shows different profiles for each of the rivets. Not necessary. All of the rivets can be gotten with one set of cutters.
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Old 07-17-2005, 11:20 AM   #16
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NewtoFals, sorry to hear about your poor customer service from Snap-On. Do you have a dealer who stops by your shop weekly? I kinda got the impression you don't since you say it took them two weeks to ship you a part. Our dealer receives the parts and gives them to us.

I guess the dealers I have dealt with are a lot better than yours. They stock the ratchet repair guts and will rebuild them while you wait. Ditto for most everything else like torx bits and such. Now, I have had him be out of stock occasionally on popular stuff like 15mm and 13mm sockets as they are the most commonly used and broken sockets, but he always had them the week after. ANY tool will break if you use it hard enough. Never had a problem with getting new ones from ANY of the tool truck dealers. Hell, MAC will even warranty stuff over the phone. We lost our MAC route driver years ago and never got a new one. A call to an 800 number and new tools are sent out no questions asked. They don't even want the old broken tool back!

Can't comment on the screwdriver tips deforming as I hardly ever use mine as screwdrivers. As a pry bar and chisel, the tips tend to snap off, not bend.
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Old 07-17-2005, 11:40 AM   #17
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Back on topic, here's a pic of my homemade (hacked on with a grinder and Dremel) boltcutter rivet setter. I ground the rivet head dimple in the outside jaw with a carbide ball burr, but I would probably use HCPookies method of a separate plate if I made another one. The thing easily reaches all the front trunion rivets and makes nice heads on the inside. It is best used with two people, one to hold and squeeze the tool, the other to line everything up in the vise. So far it has riveted 3 front trunnions without breaking. Only removed the bare minimum of metal required.
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