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-   -   What ammo do you guys use for indoor shooting? (http://www.akfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=326565)

Johnson184 11-18-2017 11:40 PM

What ammo do you guys use for indoor shooting?
 
All my local ranges prohibit bimetal jacketed bullets like Wolf, Tula, etc. Any affordable alternatives?

Extra Medium 11-18-2017 11:48 PM

Last time I went to an indoor range, I swore I'd never go back.. So.... GT, Tula, and wolf. Screw an indoor range. Especially for rifles. You can buy some of that fancy brass cased $1/round Winchester, and pay $20+/hour to shoot an ak indoors, breathing lead dust; or find yourself an outdoor range or a friend with some land. I was pissed as there were 2 of us and although they were packed andwe had to take turns on a single lane, charged us both for the hour. Then they had the balls to try to hit us for another hour each when we went 5 minutes over. Never again.

Ps, banning bimetal jackets usually is just a convenient way to justify weeding out all the steel case ammo they don't want mixed in with the used brass cases they steal and recycle. I'll never shoot at an indoor range again. Did I mention that?

ugroza 11-18-2017 11:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnson184 (Post 4332989)
All my local ranges prohibit bimetal jacketed bullets like Wolf, Tula, etc. Any affordable alternatives?

Besides .40c/round i dont think there are any other options for 5.45

csphar54r 11-19-2017 12:44 AM

So who makes copper jacketed rounds in 5.45?

Plagued 11-19-2017 03:53 AM

Hornady are steel cased but not bimetal bullets I believe.

Pheenix11 11-19-2017 04:19 AM

I'm a member at an indoor range and they don't care what I shoot. I've heard of these restrictions at indoor ranges but never understood the point of them. Seems like shooting an AK without using bimetal bullets would be expensive as hell and kinda defeats the purpose.

Tankboy 11-19-2017 12:31 PM

All ranges where I live in Indiana suck balls and hate AKs/steel case ammo. One of the biggest and most popular ranges banned ALL ak pattern rifles (even though they sell them) simply because they said that everyone who shoots there with them doesn't know how to shoot and just ends up spraying and shoot the ceiling, hitting the wall or whatever. They're also moving to ban people from shooting ARs there now too, but you can't shoot any steel case there cause it's magnetic and "tears up" whatever shit they have down there. Not all indoor ranges around me ban AKs (they're the only ones to do it so far) but the no steel case thing is pretty much like that everywhere around me unless you go to an outdoor range, but they try to regulate your rate of fire there and that's getting into another discussion lol.

MFCAMV8 11-19-2017 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tankboy (Post 4333536)
All ranges where I live in Indiana suck balls and hate AKs/steel case ammo. One of the biggest and most popular ranges banned ALL ak pattern rifles (even though they sell them) simply because they said that everyone who shoots there with them doesn't know how to shoot and just ends up spraying and shoot the ceiling, hitting the wall or whatever. They're also moving to ban people from shooting ARs there now too, but you can't shoot any steel case there cause it's magnetic and "tears up" whatever shit they have down there. Not all indoor ranges around me ban AKs (they're the only ones to do it so far) but the no steel case thing is pretty much like that everywhere around me unless you go to an outdoor range, but they try to regulate your rate of fire there and that's getting into another discussion lol.

Yep
The indoor range up here near me in Delaware County does not allow steel case ammo, brass only which means no AK-74's period :(

Zemlyak 11-19-2017 04:51 PM

Indoor with AK? Unless it is at 50 yards range min, find outdoor otherwise it is funny sorry :)

chknfkr 11-19-2017 04:58 PM

The indoor ranges I used to frequent didn't have any policy on what ammo you could or could not shoot. I just shot whatever was loaded in my mags, usually 7n6.

swolff 11-19-2017 05:59 PM

The indoor range I use doesn't care about bi-metal jackets or steel case. Just nothing AP, incendiary, or tracers

1biggun 11-19-2017 07:46 PM

You know any idiot with a magnet on a stick can seperate steel cases from brass pretty quick.
Most ranges don't give a crap about steel cases getting mixed in or there lack of resale value.

What they do care about is guys shooting crap besides the target.
That's the major reason there down on AK and AR owners.

Most ranges don't want to turn away a paying customer unless those customers cost more in damage than there worth.

Public out door range just got shut down near here due to guys leaving trash and shooting up every thing.
Seen more than a few AK owners who feel discriminated against with a chip on there shoulder just looking for reason to say it's about there rifle type when it's there behaviour that gets them told to leave . Same with newbs with ARs.

Speaking of indoor ranges what distances are you guys getting to shoot at?? Any distance?

dan326 11-20-2017 09:16 AM

Some indoor ranges will allow you to shoot different caliber Kalash but it's just on them.
Some frangible, others only brass cased and there are a few (very few) that will allow Russian commercial ammunition.

It simply depends on where you live to the reason why you'd chose to go to an indoor range.
All the good areas for shooting for me are 2 hours or more away.

They're not practical (indoor) for the grossly low range but at least you can practice off-hand and mag changes.

I target something small on the paper and try to go for groups at 25 yds.

Menhadien 11-20-2017 09:39 AM

http://www.sgammo.com/product/hornad...case-ammo-8124

That's your best bet, steel jacketed but non-magnetic projectiles

Ram Rod 11-20-2017 10:13 AM

Best alternative is to shoot outdoors.
It's hard for me to fathom and indoor range that will let anyone shoot rifles especially calibers approaching or exceeding 3000fps and that wouldn't allow bi-metal jacketed projectiles.
I have shot .308win and 6.5x55 at an indoor range and it was a 75yd concrete tube basically with layered kevlar and steel at the end. I'm sure bi-metal jacketed and/or steel core projectiles would take their toll eventually. But that's just maintenance, the cost of doing business, and what range fees should be used for.
There are plenty of things I just don't understand as well.

TangoUniform 11-20-2017 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pheenix11 (Post 4333252)
I'm a member at an indoor range and they don't care what I shoot. I've heard of these restrictions at indoor ranges but never understood the point of them. Seems like shooting an AK without using bimetal bullets would be expensive as hell and kinda defeats the purpose.

They say it's because the bimetal jacketed bullets wear out the back stop faster.

They also can't make any money selling off the steel cases like they can with brass.

Biohawk1 11-21-2017 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TangoUniform (Post 4334745)
They say it's because the bimetal jacketed bullets wear out the back stop faster.

They also can't make any money selling off the steel cases like they can with brass.

If I shoot at an indoor range I pick a corner spot and just pick up all my brass that hits the floor.

Gewehr44 11-21-2017 09:46 PM

I usually carry a box of hornady and when they inspect my ammo at the start give them that. Then shoot the GT and Wolf later on that's hidden in my bag.

I don't even go to any ranges that don't allow steel cased. God forbid if you have to explain steel cased VS bi-metal jacket to the retard at the counter. Tried that once.

Mattylight30 11-21-2017 09:51 PM

Man I'd love to see CBC/Magtech import some 5.45 with their 62g LC .223 swagged down to .221 and loaded hot.

or PPU.

1biggun 11-21-2017 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gewehr44 (Post 4337099)
I usually carry a box of hornady and when they inspect my ammo at the start give them that. Then shoot the GT and Wolf later on that's hidden in my bag.

I don't even go to any ranges that don't allow steel cased. God forbid if you have to explain steel cased VS bi-metal jacket to the retard at the counter. Tried that once.

And then you wonder why places just ban all AKs.

chillypepper 11-21-2017 11:28 PM

Only indoor ranges I've ever been to were a good long time ago. The ranges on base were pretty okay. The only others were in cali and required that you purchase ammo from them at the time you shoot.

Now, I only shoot BB's and CO2 indoors, in my house at my trap. If my only option is an indoor range I ain't going. I'll stick with the bb gun and stay home.

SuperTacOperator44 11-22-2017 02:36 AM

Yeah Hornady is the only non steel jacketed 5.45 ammo available. Its also the only non-Russian made/ non-Surplus 5.45 ammo available. And that's only helpful if you have an indoor range that also allows steel cased ammunition. Most of the indoor ranges around here don't make the distinction between steel cased and steel jacketed ammo. They just do the old "anything that attracts a magnet is banned" bullshit.

There's one indoor range around here that lets you shoot AKs but they ban the Bear/Barnual brands of ammo and one other random brand for some reason. But yet Wolf, Tula and Golden Tiger are all OK.
I Have no idea why they do that nor do I want to bring it to their attention that it's literately all the same crap. Sometimes rules make no damn sense.

I have yet to see an outdoor range that cares about steel cased ammo though. So that's where I shoot my AKs mostly. I have to drive over an hour away and make a day out of it. But why not. Shooting out in the open with a sky above you instead of a concrete ceiling with a noisy ventilation system is nice on occasion.

flakman 11-23-2017 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnson184 (Post 4332989)
All my local ranges prohibit bimetal jacketed bullets like Wolf, Tula, etc. Any affordable alternatives?

find better range or find outside range

freuderlocks 12-03-2017 10:22 AM

So there are actually a few good reasons that indoor ranges don't allow bi metal jackets. In a concrete and steel box, filled with unspent powder, do you really want a projectile that could spark a fire zipping around? I've seen an indoor range fire or two, they aren't pretty. For some ranges, the brass people leave behind is part of the revenue stream, so they don't want any steel in there as they pay a penalty (or get paid less) to whoever actually recycles and reloads he brass cases. The lead in many of these indoor ranges is also collected to be made into more bullets, usually from decelerators in the bullet traps, again steel lowers the total lead content, lowering the return on the recycled metal.

Admittedly, the last two reasons are petty. But the first is not so much. Ricochet hazard is real, depending on the range setup and the fire hazard is as well.

That being said. I don't care how fancy or expensive someone's air handling system is, it's indoors, you are being exposed to lead just by being there. Your breathing it, contaminating your clothes etc. It's so much louder in an indoor stall. Why wouldn't you just go shooting outdoors? The drive is worth the health concerns alone in my opinion.

Indoor ranges are for suckers.

Freuderlocks

katb 12-03-2017 11:42 AM

Well freuderlocks shooting copper bullets does not fully protect you. That copper gets very hot when fired and even hotter when it splatters when hitting something hard.

We do a lot of shooting at night and every so often you will get a visible hot "spark" off an impact. Now if you are watching with NV it is quite a few that are hot enough to be seen via the NV.

SAIGA 5.45 12-03-2017 01:22 PM

I don't shoot indoors anymore, never again hopefully.

If bi metal is your problem then vmax is your only hope.

freuderlocks 12-03-2017 02:16 PM

I didnt say "FMJ copper ammo is perfrect for shooting indoors", or that it doesnt spark at all. Ive seen plenty of people catch ricochets from FMJ ammo, hell even lead. The point is that it is more likely to happen with bimetal or steel, especially indoors. I didnt write the rules, im just explaining my experience with why they are so. Shooting indoors is fucking dangerous for so many reasons. I wont do it for two, ricochets, they happen more than people like to think. Lead, as previously stated, your breathing it in, I dont care what the owner/operator has to say about their fancy air handling systems and filters. You couldnt pay me to shoot indoors or even be present as an RSO for any of that.

-FreuderLocks

Quote:

Originally Posted by katb (Post 4352276)
Well freuderlocks shooting copper bullets does not fully protect you. That copper gets very hot when fired and even hotter when it splatters when hitting something hard.

We do a lot of shooting at night and every so often you will get a visible hot "spark" off an impact. Now if you are watching with NV it is quite a few that are hot enough to be seen via the NV.


katb 12-04-2017 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by freuderlocks (Post 4352431)
I didnt say "FMJ copper ammo is perfrect for shooting indoors", or that it doesnt spark at all. Ive seen plenty of people catch ricochets from FMJ ammo, hell even lead. The point is that it is more likely to happen with bimetal or steel, especially indoors. I didnt write the rules, im just explaining my experience with why they are so. Shooting indoors is fucking dangerous for so many reasons. I wont do it for two, ricochets, they happen more than people like to think. Lead, as previously stated, your breathing it in, I dont care what the owner/operator has to say about their fancy air handling systems and filters. You couldnt pay me to shoot indoors or even be present as an RSO for any of that.

-FreuderLocks

You did not state that at all. Your post was focused on two things.

1. bimetal bullets
2. health hazards

I was just brining up the fact that any bullet can cause a spark. While we have shot a boat load of frangible bullets I do not ever remember shooting them at night. Granted our night shooting is training for killing stuff on our land or, night hunting.

panzertruppe 12-07-2017 12:40 AM

I removed the projectiles,

And replace them with paint filled bullets... When they go off they make all kinds of beautiful colors..

panzertruppe

jb1911 12-07-2017 10:48 AM

We have a Point Blank range about 30 minutes away in Merrillville IN. I shoot anything I want there. It's a pretty nice place to shoot. I'd rather be shooting outdoors but haven't found a good place to do it.

burninglegs 12-07-2017 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jb1911 (Post 4357929)
We have a Point Blank range about 30 minutes away in Merrillville IN. I shoot anything I want there. It's a pretty nice place to shoot. I'd rather be shooting outdoors but haven't found a good place to do it.


You ever check out Willow Slough Gun Range in Morocco, IN?

EGMak104FR 12-07-2017 12:34 PM

If you really need to shoot indoors then I suggest you buy a 556 AK. You can get brass cased 223 for as little as 24c per rd right now. The Hornady V-Max is just not worth it for target shooting/training purposes. On average, it will cost you twice as much. That said, I think the rules against steel cased/steel cored ammo are dumb as hell. It's really just a way to make more money. They know most people don't pickup their brass, and will also give in and buy their overpriced shit they conveniently have stashed behind the counter. I've seen it too many times. The backstop and fire hazard thing is a bunch of BS, too. Plenty of brass cased rounds used that cause even more damage and pose just as much of a "hazard". It's their job to keep the floors clean and build and maintain a sturdy backstop. Nothing but more gun range fudd BS.

jb1911 12-07-2017 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by burninglegs (Post 4357996)
You ever check out Willow Slough Gun Range in Morocco, IN?

I've been there a couple of times, I heard they were upgrading it. Do you know if it's open again?

Choppa city 12-08-2017 06:22 PM

I used to love point blank in cincinnat, but they started getting ridiculous as hell the last year. 1st they banned all shotgun ammo except slugs. Then u couldnt bring a gun in unless its in a bag. Last time i went was the worst. Now u cant have your guns on the tables. They have to be under it, in a bag at all times. In order to shoot, u must get the bag, carry it to the stall, take gun out, put bag under table, go back and shoot gun. When finished, get empty bag, bring back to stall, insert gun, immediately zip it up and put back under table. Its absolutely insane

1biggun 12-08-2017 09:43 PM

Most ranges with steel cased rules have them to reduce the type of people who shoot steel cased ammo not for some profit in selling brass.

It's sort of like a dress code at a club.
No ball caps and baggy pants keeps out certain people..

When a ranges stuff gets shot up or there customers get pissed by none respectful shooters they loose money.

Some ranges have legitimate concerns with steel core bullets and guys sneaking in shit dosent help so they just banned all steel case shit to cover there bases.

I have never desire to shoot a rifle inside but to each there own.

I realize many don't have a lot of options.


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