saiga 5.45x39 bullet guide

Just finishing my saiga/ak-74 and need to build a bullet guide. Anyone know the dimensions for the 5.45x39 with flat ramp?
Here she is by the way:

http://www.norphar.com/saigaconvert.jpg

Looks nice!

Dinzag has them if you wanna go that route?

Just about any of the Saiga feed ramp conversions should work. The Saiga bolts are all similar to the 5.45 bolt and all should clear the same ramps. Is your trunnion round bottom? Flat bottom? Has a rivet hole or no rivet hole? Edit: I see it's a flat bottom trunnion. Does it have a rivet hole?

The flat bottom trunnion can use a straight bullet guide or an original 5.45 bullet guide that has been cut to clear the bolt turning pin on the left side.

Why do these need a bullet guide?

Do they not come with one already?

And if not how is their performance without one?

I am Saiga illiterate.

I have only messed with my S-12, but never one of the rifles.

For some reason, that I have yet to comprehend, Saigas don't have the usual bullet guide but instead rely upon the front lip of the magazine to direct the bullet upward into the chamber. Compare a normal mag to a saiga mag and you can see where the normal mag is cut out at the front where the bullet feeds out. Without the bullet guide the bullets dont go up into the chamber, they smash into the rim of the chamber instead of going in. You either need high cap mags that were designed for the saiga with the integral bullet guide or you need to mount one on the gun. It won't work very well without one. Ask me how I know.

I've also heard, but never tried it myself, that you can run a bead of weld along the area where the bullet guide would be to bump the round upward but I'm not sure how well that works and might be a problem with the trunion heat treat.

Thanks for the responses. This is a result of our group buy kit married to the new 5.45x39 saiga. As far as the bullet guide, the challenge makes me think I will try and build one for it. It is not the same as cutting a piece of 3/4" pipe nipple as it has a flat bottom trunion, but I can use a piece of flat stock instead. I was looking at the pictures of Dinzag's and it looks fairly simple. I have also been looking at the saiga mag vs the standard 30 rounder and can see the saiga mag has a lip in the front that works as a bullet guide. Not sure exactly how to make the bolt clearance cut but will play it by ear. As far as the difference, maybe they want to sell more of their own mags instead of having people use existing mags or maybe they have a large Kalifornia market.

Ok here is what I made with a piece of flat steel, grinder and dremel cutoff wheel:

http://www.norphar.com/bulletguidetop.jpg

http://www.norphar.com/bulletguideside.jpg

The pointed part slips under the barrel out of sight. The beveled portion is on the bottom to clear the mag. It works well just sitting in there cycling rounds, but I don't want to drill and tap the trunion yet. I think I may epoxy it in and take it to the range before I make it permanent. We'll see how it holds up to live fire with epoxy, but hopefully it will make it through a mag.

I'll update then.

The Saiga's do not have a bullet guide so they can be imported with the full size double stack magazine hole in the receiver. The bullet guide is part of the plastic 10 round magazine. If the Saiga had a bullet guide it would have to only take single stack magazines to be imported.

Ok, got it.

Thanks all!

So how do you put them in? I think you cant rivet it without pulling the trunion, so what then?

Drill and tap?

Dont know about the epoxy deal? I wouldnt trust that.

I'm going to drill and tap it after I check function. The epoxy is just to test it out by running one mag through as it doesn't take much abuse in there. I don't even see any marks from the bullets hitting the guide at all. The standard mags actually feed fairly well without the guide on this model but I think it needs one to ensure complete reliability.