Arsenal SA M-7

Just picked up an Arsenal SA M-7 that looks brand new in the box.
Can someone please give me some information about it?
It has a Krebs peep sight on it instead of the standard type sight.
Did Arsenal ever offer this as an option?
There is no rail on the receiver so I guess that was an option.
Also it is not stamped Made in Bulgaria, does that mean the quality is not
as good?
The only thing in the box was the sling & the 30 round mag, no manual.
The sn is AB 00 06XX

AirCop46

all i know is that the sas m7 was a limited edition made in 06,it is not marked made in bulgaria! i dont know about the sight but hear only 400 were made and nib now is $1200-1500. hope this helps you, sounds like you got a winner! :small_gri

Thanks for the info. vz58kid

Just found out from another person that the first 2 digits in the SN should be the year it was made so if this is correct it was made in 2000 & over 600 were produced. (The SN is AB 00 06XX )

The SA M7 never was offered with a peep sight. I assume by the serial number yours is a post-ban model with the shark-gill muzzle brake pinned on, correct?

If so, those were some of the finest ones made. A lot appeared to have hand-fitted parts. They are much less sloppy than some of the later no-ban models.

Good find!

I wanted to wait until I got home to check it before I got back with you.
Yes, it does have the shark-gill muzzle brake on it, three cuts on each side of the break & it is pinned.
Any addition information would be appreciated as the manual was missing in the box which would have stated when it was made.
I still beleive it was 2000 based on the SN.
There was a SA M-7 on Gun Broker awhile back showing a picture of the manual and the SN was AB 04 0216 with the production date of Jan 03 2005.
Maybe I will try and contact Arsenal to see if they can give me any other info.

i dont know if its true about the year being part of ser. no. my 107 fr was made in 07 and serial is ad 47 11xx, you might be best to call arsenal ask for a manual, most co. will sent one for free! there seem to be a lot of opinions of how many of your gun type was made. i hear that the first batch of 200 was made in 2000 and then another batch of 200 in 2004 but that is hear-say i have run across several people wanting to know how many were made! there are many different versions of the sa m-7 that were made during a couple of years. http://www.smallarmsreview.com/pdf/sam7.pdf i think this is what you have!

Just got off the phone with Julia at Arsenal.
After sereral questions she said that she wasn't allowed to give out information
on serial numbers.
But I think that it would be fair to say after talking with her.
That any Arsenal milled receiver that is not stamped "Made In Bulgaria" they did use the first 2 digits of the SN as the year the receiver was made.
See attachment for example taken off of GunBroker listing.
SN AB 04 XXXX date of production Jan 03 2005

i think you are right about the ones made here using ser. no. of year. did you get a manual? did you find out how many were made?what years?did the link to small arms review help give you some info? what about peep sight?how much is it worth? thanks! :small_gri it really is a great gun, i guess they dont want to give out info on s. no. so nobody knows how many were made!

Yes, she was nice enough to email the manual which was for a SA M-7R.
The R is for a rail model which I don't have, but she said that was the only one
she had for that model.
I found out that Arsenal never installed a peep sight on any of their AKs so the
first owner must have put it on.
Didn't get around to asking her how many were made or what years they were in
production as she really sounded busy.
She did say that they get alot of request for this model but tells them that they
are no longer made.
The link that you posted looks just like mine, even the muzzle break.
Some of the later models of the SA M-7s had the bird cage muzzle breaks on them.
Thanks for the link & the info.

happy for you,you got a great gun and its better than money in bank, arsenal had a 15% increase in price on all their guns in the last few weeks.if you ever want to put the original sight on,should not be a problem or much of an exp. if you find a gunshop that builds them and they usually have all kinds of parts fairly cheap! over the years i had always wanted an arsenal since have always heard they are the best of whats readily available,i did love their 106 fr that came out last year but that 5.56 is not much of a caliber.but it beats throwing rocks,(i do have 2 ars) so the 107 line just came out in feb.and last sat. at show i saw 2 107s folders, both were top notch and i picked up the 107 fr for $875. talked him down from $919. msrp is over $1000. so i bought it still with tax and back-ground cost me $975 out the door! when i get home i go on net about had a stroke, it was burning up with complaints about the 107s,slanted sights,bore not centered,etc.. did not get much rest till monday called arsenal to find out if mine was a newer model and was affected. turns out i got lucky and i has no problems only the ones sold in feb. did! so i am a very happy camper! :small_gri :angel1: no matter who gets elected, i really believe there is another ban coming,and from what i read about it,it is a lot worse than the last one!

Hi, thanks for are the good words about my SA M-7.
It sounds like you are really happy with your 107 that you picked up at the gun show especially after Arsenals 15% price increase.
Everybody that buys a gun always wants to get a deal, it just makes them feel
better and kinda justifys their purchase.
Yes, the political situation in this country will drive the sale of guns to an all time high for the next 6 mounths. Then after that your guess is as good as anybodys.
Its not only the guns that people are buying now, but they should make sure to
have plenty of ammo to put in them. The cost for ammo has gone sky high this
past year.
I just ordered my second case of 7.62 x 39 from the link below.
Its shoots and functions great in my AKs, plus its real brass & not that Wolf junk. It was made in Yugoslavia in the 70s and it looks brand new out of the box.
Check it out if you are getting low on ammo.
http://www.samcoglobal.com/index.html
Remember the old saying, " Its better to have and not need it than to need it and not have it"
Anyway I think thats how the saying goes.
Take Care INVEST IN AMERICA AND BUY A GUN.

just found out today that norinco usa will later this year produce copies which are all brand-new usa made of many of their famous aks like the polytech, as well as the legend.and if that is not enough they will also make usa made 75 and 100 round drums, hope we still will be able to get some of their goodies. if you can find a chinese drum avg. price is $250-350 respectively.when this happens it will not drop the value of any chinese items since those are the real thing and the new stuff is usa made clones! on gunbroker there have lately been advertised as norinco clones of the polytech underfolder made with us receiver and barrel and some original parts going for $1.300-1.500 which is really sad. i was lucky and bought a type 56 poly folder with spike bay. in mint for $900. in 1999 and have been offered up to $1600 but no thanks,have seen some go for up ..to $1800 on net. even a slr 95 which was going for $350 in 98 is now selling for over $900 on net, maybe i will be able to get another 75 and a 100 round drum if the price is reasonable,the chinese drums are the best and easiest to use out there,all others are tedious to load and have no wind-up spring and are a pain to fool with and in my opinion useless, mainly due to being time consuming. that yugo ammo on that link looks great however back during last ban and getting ready for Y2K i ordered more than enough ammo for all my guns. 98% is sealed in military spam cans so at least there i am in good shape.it is really sad about ammo prices going up 100% just in the last year, but it is always better to have and not need, than to need and not have or cant get! :straightf

Several months ago I bought a Chiness Norinco NHM 90 AK type 56S that was made in factory 66. I would rate it at about 98% just afew dings in the wood.
I picked it up for $660 and just wonder how your news about Norinco is going
to effect its value?
You don't see very many of the NHM 90 models anymore as the MAK 90s are all over the place.
Mine has the pinned slant muzzle brake that screws off but is missing the bayonet lug & comes with the regular stock, not the thumbhole stock.
This one was a transition model that was imported in early 1990 before the ban was modified to remove the pistol grip and add the thumbhole stock.

your 56s sounds nice,you do know that you can get rid of most dings, if they are not to deep and have no sharp points or edges in the ding, by simply taking a damp cotten towel put steam-iron on hot and hold it against towel and steaming it but dont hold it on there to long or you can burn the wood. i would not lose any sleep about value when and if the new norinco clones come out, collecters and gun purists will still only want the real thing instead of a perfect clone but the new ones would attract the avg. shooter, and then there is a question of price which most likely will be around a grand or more,but who knows! i had stated that recently norinco type 56 clones made by Bubba with u.s. made receiver and barrel and a few norinco parts going for $1200- 1400 when a original mint one has a value of $1400-1800 or more. i just want to get some more drums, but i would think their price will be close to the prices for originals, which isnt cheap. turned my sig 556 into a folder by ordering a ace fold.-bracket and adapter, finally got here yesterday and i really love it, set it up to fold left. :small_gri

tried to find out today when any norinco usa models will be available, no luck, at the shot show in feb. they were displaying new drum mags and saying that aks will be available soon! from what i can find out,it might be 2009 before we see any.they have a website up but every section i click on goes to the same picture, they do have now a 120 round drum for the ar in 5.56 available works and looks like the reg. chinese drums, really nice! about fainted when i found out it is selling for $379 wholesale, so i would guess that their new usa made drums in 7.62x39 will be selling for pretty close to this range. which to me would seem to drive the originals value even higher, since who would not pay extra and get the real deal instead of something not even made on the original machinery. from what i read on different forums the dude who bought the norinco usa trademark does eventually plan to make parts for all norinco guns as well as guns. since they cant get the original mach. it might even end up being more problems than anything! also i know of many instances where a famous gun maker allows their guns to be foreign made under license and they turn out to be pure junk, but lets hope for the best, but myself i would not be among the first to buy any usa norinco anything! :huh_small

Thanks for the info. about fixing the dings in the furniture, they are small ones from handling but the next time I have the steam iron out I will try it.
Anyway guess we had better stop talking about Norincos since we are on a Arsenal forum as we might get kicked off.
The Arsenal website really leaves alot to be desired.
It would be great if they had an archive link on their site showing model numbers, dates and serial numbers. I know it would really cut down on the amount phone calls that Julia gets. She is really great, just loaded with information.
Just wonder if anybody at Arsenal reads any of the post on the AK forums?
If so there is always hope that they will update their website, but then again that would take away all the fun of talking with Julia.

:love_smal julia really is an asset to arsenal, she really helped me out a lot. i just wish that i could find out how many models of mine will be made? since it is limited production, but i have heard that they sometimes will re-issue a model a few yrs. after original prod. has stopped! but i can see why they have to be secret about a lot of this stuff since there are many others trying to keep up with their products and copying them. it is no different than the car or any other business where you dont know exactly what something will look like till the last minute. but i am getting tired of all this arsenal bashing so they messed up on some guns, thats bad but this can happen to any company and has and still is. i know of 6 companies of whom i have guns and all their first ones had problems of one type or another and some now have different ones. i do know what kind of a mess and headache it is to have some of these problems and i do feel sorry for anyone who has one of the problem ones. back in around 98-99 Professional Ord. came out with their carbon 15 pistols and rifles and after reading 4 reviews in different mags. of how great they were i had my dealer order the pistol which even back then was about $900 so i got the top model 97 and ordered all the excessories and a bunch of mags and carrying case and the total bill was about $1300. the pistol was great the first 2 times out, then it jammed etc. etc. long story short i sent it in to be fixed 3 times and in-between that had to have them sent me parts after each shooting session, you talk about a headache and stress! finally after the 3rd time back they got it fixed and has been working great and am glad i have it, mean little pistol. a lot of them from what i hear could not be fixed, and Bushmaster bought out the co. and alledgedly still seems to have problems with those guns. but i really love my arsenal 107 i just do wish the would bring the classic underfolder back with the wood furn. which was a limited run and is discontinued! :small_gri

Most of that Arsenal bashing is being done by people who either bought their first Arsenal and it ended up having a problem or by people who just don't know and think that their brand of AK is superior.
Yes it can happen to any company even Sig & Kimber have had their problems.
I am not a big fan of the underfolders and I know that they look cool and bad but I would much rather have a full lenght NATO or a side folder.
As they say what ever turns you on go for it.
I have only seen one underfolder lately that did anything for me it was beautiful.
It had a milled receiver made by Firing Line with Bulgarian parts & Russian
furniture on it. It looked great.
Here is a link to it as the listing is still up on GunBroker.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=97441494

yes,that sure was a nice looker but $1200 for a parts gun is downright outrageous, for that money or about $100-200 more you can get a real polytech new. also there are so many usa made receivers and most are different levels of junk! i am a purist and will seldom (did it only 1x) buy an ak-parts gun which was a yugo made by century (they made a good one in that model) all 6 others of mine are all original. i bought my yugo last yr. for $480 now the dealer is selling them for $660 and at the shows for $700. which is hard to believe. so now i have all the aks i need, 2 are fixed, 2 are side fold. 2 are underfolders. but my all-time fav. is the gray nib vz-58 folder i got 3 months ago for $799 +shipp and transfer. my norinco is worth 2 1/2 x that but its not what something is worth but how much you like it and i love the vz-58 since i had wanted one since 99 but the only one available then was the re-verse engineered piece of junk called vz 2000 by ohio ord. they only made it for a few months in 99 and could never get it to shoot, so they quit making it for 6-7 yrs. and re-issued them last yr. for $1250. but late last yr. CZ finally shipped in theirs 100% slovakian made, when i got it i felt like it was worth waiting on for 10 yrs. and i really want to get another one before nov. :angel1: :small_gri

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=102283607

:uhoh_smal had a really great laugh the above listed piece of junk was being listed for $1250 a few weeks ago, now its up again. as far as i can tell there is nothing original to this gun except maybe the pistol grip as to that type was only used later. this idiot is selling this as a norinco clone with norinco parts, the folder is not chinese the upper gastube should have 4 holes,gas-block cant be real ,bottem on the real one is open,the front sight is fake as well as the bay.the original one was a 1 piece unit, this bay. is held in place by screws to barrel and original one had no ring to go on muzzle nut, is also 1 inch to short, muzzle nut also fake, he lists a smooth chin. top cover, the one on gun is neither chin. or smooth, rear sight also fake chin. went only to 800 distance.they way this junk is advertised as usa receiver and trigger group and all else as chin. even the finish is wrong, real ones were blued. seeing such a piece of junk just really makes me appreciate my 56 aks even more! just feel sorry for the fool who buys it, he might be better off getting a Wasr, it has more real parts, i would not pay more than $200. for this and then only as for parts if ever needed! :laugh_sma :mad_small ps the mag. is also not chin.

After looking at the listing & all the pictures, you are right on. It does look like junk. You would at least think that it would come with a Chinese mag. but it doesn't.
Just wonder how much the reserve is & what it will go for?

still wish i could find anarsenal m-7 classic underfolder at a decent price. this dude selling the clone on gunbroker is a major dealer who has at least 70 guns listed. what really had me upset is that last month the buy now price on that gun was $1250.i just could not believe the bayonet screwed on barrel by a clamp + 2 screws. the other day somewhere a dude posted a question about wanting to put a bay. on his 56 which had the lug cut off. someone posted a pic. of the 1 piece sight +bay. unit which includes bay. for $200. also he posted the clamp on barrel bay. which sells for $50. which is what was on the gun on gunbroker.that gun has no value to a collecter, even an amateur like me! once gun i would love to buy, which is a chin. 86 bull-pup, it is about the ugliest gun i have seen in a long time selling on broker now for $ 2300 i dont know but that is about $700. to high for me, i had a chance in the 90s to buy a 5.56 bull-pup new for a good price cal. i did not get it but have always regretted that. the most valuable aks are the early tube stock Valmets, but only in 7.62 cal. when those were first sold here nobody wanted them since they were so damn ugly, now the price is $3500 + since there are not many available. everyone always claim Valmet is the Holy Grail of AKs, some are but all the early models had many prob. like fold. mech. falling apart etc.. sort of reminds me of arsenal. sig is still having prob. with their 556 folders not working properly not locking etc. thats why i bought the ace fold. mech. which is fantastic. the worst thing one can do is buy sight unseen even if new, at least on gunbroker, but if really rare and seller is reputeable you will be out of $50.-60. on shipping. myself i rather pay a little more and check all out at show before i buy! :D

Good luck on finding that Arsenal SA M-7 Classic underfolder.
I am sure somewhere out there someone has one for sell but the price might not
be right.
A local gun shop here has a new Arsenal SA M-7 underfolder for $1195 but it is not a classic.
Arsenal must have made a bunch of milled receivers and held on to them for one resaon or another as the second two digits in the SN on the one above are 05.
I beleive the receivers are stamped with the serial number the day they were made & not the day that the gun was built.
Who knows maybe there was a shortage of Bulgarian parts that year?
Or maybe somebody bought it in 2005 and left it in the box and nerver shot it &
traded it in or sold it to the gun shop.
Anyway I just thought it was strange to see a new one with an 05 in the serial number if my theory holds true on Arsenal milled receivers made in the US.

A lot of receivers marked 05 were just released as rifles several months ago.

The date refers to the date the receiver was made, and not the rifle.

i figure the m-7 classic folder is $1200-1500 avg. and if i ever see one it will be on the net, the thing that makes all types of their limited editions so exp. is no one knows how many were made and no one will ever know except a few people at arsenal, just like on your rifle, i have read 200 made in 2000, 400 in 2002 and another 600 in 2006 on different forums, but 1 person has a ss no. in the middle 600s so who knows. one thing i cant understand is this. the 107 series was made in 07 and sold as of 1-31-08 and most of those have the problems!i was told by julia that mine was shipped may 5th 08 and the problems were solved at that time. from what i read the 107s were made and assembled in bulgaria in 07 which mine says so, and when they get here the single-stack magwell is milled to double and usa made trigger group installed as well as usa furn.! so how can they have solved the problems of the earlier ones, unless the double-checked every gun in stock and fixed the problems with the sights and off-center bores as well as the paint problems? i just wish i knew how limited this run will be but dont think anyone will ever know, the less there will be the higher the value! the mystery deepens!!!! :uhoh_smal

Is the 107s your favorite AK? You really seem to like it in your above post.
Since I have never seen one, guess that I will have to go check one out.
My other Arsenal a SLR-101s sounds close as it was made in Bulgaria with a single stack magwell then shipped over here to have it modified to except the double stack magazine.
The stamped lettering, finish, parts and how smooth everything fits doesn't come close to my SA M-7 even tho the SLR was made in Bulgaria.
Julia said the SLR was made in 2000, thats the same year my SA M-7 was made but what a differance in the two AKs.
You would have thought that the Bulgarian would have been better quality than the SA M-7 which was made here in the US.
The only thing that they have in common is that they both preform flawlessly
with no problems & thats what I like about the Arsenals AKs.
Yes you are going to pay more for one but you get what you pay for & a hole lot more.

is my 107 my favorite ak? that is like asking which of your children do you like best! my favorite is my 1986 polytech aks folder with the spike bay.due to its value and also i love the blueing, its the only ak i have that is totally blued!but the 107 i bought is right behind it, the quality and deep finish is great,but i hear most gun cleaners will take the finish right off,especially brake cleaner and a lot of people had that happen.arsenal says only use CLP which to me smells really bad, oh well.last year the 106s really caught my eye, except i dont like a 5.56 cal. ak. the only 2 107 i have ever seen was 2 weeks ago when i bought one at show, i could have bought the 107 f for $100 cheaper since it has no scope rail and i was debating which to get but am glad i bought the 107 fr. i really am nuts about it love that left fold. stock but i hate that huge 24mm compensater on it makes gun about 3 1/3 inches longer.would love to replace with slant-brake but no luck on there, due to fact even though the comp. screws off the 24mm tread is part of the ft. sight and i would have to replace it and the have the barrel threaded for the other brake, which would not be cheap and i would reduce value of gun. well cant have everything! i did ealier find a sa m7 classic on G.Broker for $1495 which is steep,they were made in 05 and that is about $300 more than i want to pay, with shipp. and ffl transfer and background check it would run $1570. i had thought it would be blued which i found out it isnt which makes it a little less desireable to me and have read that a lot of folks wish the same. i do plan on getting 1 more ak before the election had wanted a bushmaster Masada in 7.62x39 but no found out wont be avail. in that cal. till maybe next year that gun will go for $1200-1400 avg. and the FN scar should also be ought later but it will be around $2000. so who knows i have been tempted to get the new NORINCO USA 120 round mag for my ARs but it will run me about $410 with shipp. but i really just dont know always wanted a C Mag but they are very unreliable from all i hear, but when you need to add dry lube which comes with it to use it, that should tell you something also they range $220. were $450 during ban. i had hoped Norinco usa products would be cheaper but it seems they will costly and then its hard to tell how good the quality and function is? maybe there will be reviews on it soon! the best prices on a lot of guns is on ATLANTIC FIREARMS my 107 fr is $819. on Gbroker they are up to $950, but i will recommend to anybody to get the 107 fr instead of the 107 f model even though its $100 more but that scope rail is really desireable and i am thinking about getting original russian compact optics for it for around $220. :small_gri

forgot to mention that tan furn. is now available, however i prefer the black on all guns have been reading quite a few reports where people bought PS 90S in green only to have the plastic painted black! it to me seems black is the most desired on all guns especially to collectors, however at first the new color guns seem to cost more, even the tan 107s seem to go for about $75-$100 more at least on net!
when i bought my PS 90 for $1499 last year the dealer had it marked $1899. i bought it, asked dealer why $100 more for a green one? he said its a rarer color and a newer one. to me at least black seems to represent the Dark Side at least on assault type weapons! :evil: :small_gri






:angel1:

Yep that kind of sounds expense to get your 107fr setup the way that you want it and get rid of that 24mm comp.
I don't know if I am missing something but wouldn't it be cheaper if you would have picked up a SLR107cr and just had the barrel threaded and added a slant break?
Anyway maybe this will help the next guy that wants one set up the same way.
Here is a link to a Arsenal 107cr on GunBroker for $855 with $25 on shipping.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=101667863

well i had no plan to buy anything at show but another VZ-58 in gray but could not find one. i did not know what arsenal had avail. and this was an impulse buy! i did check arsenal web when i got home and saw the 107 cr. but is also has the same set-up as the FR with the sight/block comb. but unlike mine once compensater is removed the cr has about 3 1/3 inches of barrel showing. so it would be harder than the FR to change it since one would have to put the new sight further up-front or cut some 3 inches from barrel and that will make it an SBR. the MSRP on the CR is $150 more than on the FR. the CR on GB is the one without any type of comp. but it looks like it does have some ugly type of a 24mm non-func. block attached to sight base and then to have the front of barrel treaded would run $50-$75 min. and would ruin collecter value!
the UR model has a plain barrel and cant take any type of attach. as is? lists for almost $300 more then the FR. and that is to much, also to me at least the UR doesnt look AK-ish enough and i believe i bought the best model available, this is simply a case of you cant have everything, the way you want it and if i had to do it again i would still buy it. but i have heard a lot of good things about that compensator,which has a reg. price of around $90. from what i know the new 108 model, when it comes out will be a regular ak with the slant muzzle. i think these will be a lot cheaper since they have no fold. stock or other options. hopefully those wont have any prob. since i am finding out that a lot of the 106 models and even some 105s had the same problems as the early 107s, which is really strange! i really love mine and am only stating what i wish but i wish for some things and it never happens! :love_smal

Don't tell anybody but we may have a special person sign in and join the Akfiles Forums.
I don't want to name any names but she works for Arsenal and is just full of
great information.
The other day I mentioned to her about the Arsenal Forum and how popular she was and how everybody appreciated her help in answering their questions.
I emailed her a link to this site so hopefully she will check it out.
She said that she would like interacting with us & answer any questions or
concerns that we might have.
If she can't then there might be a legal problem of some kind since she works for Arsenal & can only answer our questions by phone or office email.
Guess we will just have to wait and see.

that is great news, there is a lot more i would like to know about our co. just hope that no one gets in trouble! i can understand some info. as to how many made could be a trade secret, since the fewer out there the more they are worth, also Bubba surely always wants to know all about what the competition is up to and our guns are made by the biggest co. out there! i would not sell my 107 fr for $1500 i really belive it is the best newly made one that is available! and if and when Norinco USA starts making their clones, next year maybe if they can and no ban happens, they will cost as much and most likely more that the originals are worth. that is what happenrd to their new 120 round ar-15 drum ! $400. that is about what a 100 round chinese drum is going for on the avg. thanks for the info. :rofl_smal

the more i think about this great news, the more i keep thinking of the worst case scenarios, and hope we dont lose the best friend we got in the co. i have worked for avg. companies over the yrs. where i had to sign papers stating that if i release any type of info. that can be use by the competition. i would lose my job! and if something is told even along the lines of what could be considered secret info. surely someone would let something slip and Big Brother would find out. especially at this time since so many people are highly upset at this company!
like i was told some info. that i was not supposed to be told!
this is dangerous ground! :(

There is a going to be a local gun show in my area this week end so I hope that I will have a chance to see a 107fr that you like so much.
As many Aks that you have there must be something really special about the 107fr.
Will let you know if I do see one and what I think about it.

well i hope you enjoy it! see if you can find a czech. VZ-58 rifle in the original gray color, they have only been available since late last year and are the hottest item on a gun nuts list.
i got one in feb. for $799. in the original gray enamel with the reddish resin furn. they are imported from Czech. byCZ the early ones before feb. came with black furn. and an ugly skeleton stock as well could only take a 10 round mag. also have a 5 yr. warr. but beware BUBBA has 6 comp. that make their own receivers and add parts kit. also century makes their own thats how hot they are. the real ones came only in gray not black! Atlantic and Centerfire still sell them for $799. on GB they are up to $1000. even the early ones with black furn. and 10 round mags.
if anybody wants to get a rare AK type weap. this is it the only thing it has in common with the AK is the ammo, but centerfire sells 4 mags in original leather pouch for $60. this gun weighs 1.5 pounds less the AK and has milled receiver also a mag weighs 1/2 what an ak mag weighs.
i have been looking at shows for 1 more in gray but only have seen some by Bubba in black with poor quality finish! i hope i can find one more soon but they are getting hard to come by, parts kits are almost gone, i also got one as well as 13 mags and bay. the only thing i dont like about them is the bay. lug was cut before import, but most of the ones made by Bubba do have lugs.
if i have to go in harms way and could have 1 gun only, it would be my VZ-58,due to being milled and weighing loaded 2 pounds less than an ak, is more accurate,less parts,easier to strip and easier to handle and aim also very rare!
if i could afford it i would buy 10 of those, their value will go up more than any ak, but lately they are getting scarse, there were only very few made unlike 80 million aks, right now i dont remember how many offhand.
but check up on those,at a show a fair price is $850-875.
there are many forums on net, check out some of my posts on Surplusrifles.com
sorry i cant put a link up, my comp is really going in slo-mo! go into the czech. mil.rifles. :D :tongue_sm they are as different from an ak as day is from night!

That CZ VZ58 looks good in the link below to bad it will not except the Ak magazines.
This one is not the gay enamel you mentioned it looks black in the picture.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=102689715

no, that is the real deal, it is the gray heat-treated enamel unlike a lot out there that have a cheap black color,this gray color is actually gray-blueish and will look like it changes darker depending how light hits it.
this is my numero uno (1) love of my live gun, it is very nostalgic i had wanted one since 99 when Ohio Ord put some out called VZ2000 almost bought one, back then it was going for around $1100 but after a few months they stopped selling them, since they all jammed!
OhioO. started selling them again last yr. for $1250 but all collectors call those a reverse-engineered piece of junk! they only come in 30 rounders.
i got mine from Centerfire in feb. and love it, also got a parts kit and 2 mag pouches with mags and bay. it takes 30 seconds and a screwdriver to go from fold to fixed. and the fixed is curved in back making it very comf.
i would order another but dont like to buy unseen, also a few of the receivers have some rough machining spots on them.
i try only to buy the best, just like when buying a car, you dont want scratches or orange-peel in finish! the bad thing is, the barrels are 15 1/2 in. long so they weld an ext. on it, so one cant put a brake on it or even a lug, without having to re-finish the gun! it has 5 usa parts trigger,sear,disconnecter,and the mag has usa made follower and base plate!
the trigger is made out of polymer, which is un-usual but so are many guns! the mags for it are $13.-15. the mag that comes with it also has polymer usa made follower and base plate.
so to be section 22 compliant, technically if you buy original mags for it
,in order to use them in gun you should put usa made foll. and plate in them, they sell for $6.50 each.
but i haver never heard of any-one arrested for lack of compliance parts. most ak people who got one love it compared to liking their ak. also they have fought in 20 wars (police actions) and are still in use with the czech. forces! also there are tons of acces. available for sights,rails etc.. they cant hardly jam since unlike the ak the whole ft. top of receiver slides back to eject, basically in the 1 0glock position. remember its milled and weighs 2 pounds less loaded than an ak.
with the state of gun restrictions and some type of ban will be here,on assault weapons, if not this yr. than next this is the 1 to get, this is from an ak nut. i have 2 guns that cost me 3x the price of the VZ but it is the Holy Grail at least to me! :skull_cro :small_gri PS. enjoy the show! :)

just remembered only 1 million VZ-58s were produced, compared to 80 million AKs. so they are quite rare!
Skycop, (sorry meant Aircop) i always wondered if you really are a cop? never know, but if so, everything i have is 100% legal and compliant! thanks! :D

Yes, many years ago when I was in the Air Force I was an AP ( Air Police ) which was the same thing as an Army MP ( Military Police )
Later on the Air Force changed the name from AP to SP which stands for Security Police. I think they changed the name sometime in 1966.

That CZ VZ58 GunBroker link that I posted is from a dealer in this area if I don't see one at the show tommorow I might have stop by and look at it.
Do you know how long the stock is, is it the standard Nato lenght?
Just wonder if they make it with black furniture & a folding stock?

:D thats what i thought, just needed to be sure i wasnt comm. with the ATF! check Centerfire systems to see picture of 1 with fold. stock. that is where i got mine had to wait 4 weeks and when i got it, even though i told them make sure its the original gray, it was except the folder and mag was black! but the finish and all was perfect.
i called them up they said they have no control of how they come, and that they were suprised that they all of a sudden came with the original red bakelite type furn. instead of the fake black furn.
let me say this! i hope no one ever thinks that i am bragging, am not but just love certain guns.
i am an avg. joe who bought his first ak in 96 during the ban for $250 Wum1 great gun except had thumb-hole, no lug,and welded brake, for the next 3 years i was craving to have 1 one with a folder,lug and screw on brake. but i could not afford $1000 for one with all those features! when i bought my aks 56 with all the goodies in 99 after saving, i felt like i went to heaven! :D
on the VZ58 stock size, centerfire lists fixed and folded for both guns at 35 1/2 in.
however i think those are the original lenghts without the 1/2 welded on barrel ext.
i just measured mine, both stocks are a little curved, included that. the fixed stock meas. 9 3/4 in. with it gun is 35 3/4 in.
fold. stock meas.9 1/2 in. including fold. mech. the gun is 25in. long incl. fold. mech. when stock is folded and 34 1/4 un-fold. so the fixed stock adds 1 1/2 in.
CZ contracted with D-technix in Czech. to produce semi-auto receiver and adds new unused parts and assmbles the guns there, the first ones were imported with a Zytel black skel. stock and black furn.(which never was mil. issue)
also those were sold with 10 round plastic mags and could not take high-caps! then in early 08 the new ones were imported as tactical models with the black furn. most of those took only 10 round mags and were going for $650. then those were also made for high-caps only and went to $800.
the sporter version which i have comes with the red original furn. which is what the true collector like me wants! unfortunately i have read 11 accts of people ordering 1 and are shocked when the get 1 in all black or get a low-cap. version when they wanted the high-cap.
i also hear that lately all come in black not the orig. Gray-blue and that new new finish is cheap and doesnt last!
i would recommend if one buys one get the folder, with everything in gray!over the yrs. the gray came in 3 different shades, that is why i recommend the folder so its 100% match. a complete fold. stock goes for $40. lately i have seen some in all wood furn. blonde, which was used in the first few yrs. and then they switched to the reddish resin!
there are all different stocks and hand-guards available at a decent price, as well as guards with 1911 rails for acc. as well as original receivers covers for scopes. since these weapons are still in use the czechs. have updated for accessories. the only thing is parts kits are hard to get now, but with a 5 yr. warr. should not really be needed unless someone wants to change furn. anything else you like to know, drop a post! Ps. like all imports these are imported as single-stack and converted to double here by a sub-contractor! :)

Thanks for all that info. just hope that I will see some tommorow at the show.
If not there will be another larger gun show later next month.
Will also be checking out the Arsenal 107rf if they have one there.

The gun show was ok but I didn't see any VZ 58s or 107s.
The only Arsenals there were 106s and alot of run of the mill Saigas, Romanians & Century Arms Imports.
Ran into an old friend there and I ask him if he has seen any Arsenals or VZ 58s and he said no, just the 106s that I had seen.
I ask him about the VZ 58 and beleive it or not he has one.
He talked about it and pretty much said the same things that you did " it is the best hands down".
So it looks like you have a keeper.

thats sounds like me, have gone to 6 shows in 6 months all fair to good! the 107 and 58 both hit the shows in jan. but have only seen 3 58s and 2 107s, arsenals you seldom see, i guess due to price! did see 2 106s last year! i will be going to big show in aug. and do hope to find a vz in gray by CZ and not bubbas junk. have to be careful, 6 diff. usa co. are putting the VZ out. when you had asked about my fav. ak. i did not list the VZ since tech. not ak. some people hate the color and furn. but seems, all love them once they shoot it and cant quit talking that its better than the ak.
up until late last year i had not bought any guns in 5-6 yrs! made up for it since then! but i think 1 more VZ-58 soon i hope, and i will stop! (hopefully) have also bought a lot mil-surp pist. prices on them have gone crazy like all else! i just dont like changing stock on the 58, so to have 1 of each solves that! :small_gri

Here is the replay back from Julia that I just received.
Sorry guys she just can't join us on the Akfiles forum and chat with us.

I’ve been checking out the forums. Unfortunately you guys are just going to have to call me with your questions, but I just wanted to thank you for the nice things that you had to say about myself and the wonderful company that I work for!

Talk to you later.

Julia

Arsenal, Inc.

i had thought that if Julia would have joined, it would be a conflict of interest! i just hope that Arsenal does realize what a great asset they have in her! also it seems that the new 108 model wont be out till next yr.
i am very happy about the 2nd amend. ruling, but shocked at a 5-4 vote!
great news but a lot of people, myself incl. believe that there still will be an assault weapons ban. also with ak prices going up and up, we are at the point where anything decent,( YUGO m-70 is going for $700.) will be at $1000. by next yr. well gas is to be $7.00 a gallon in 2 yrs. :sad_small