IS stay open when empty LEGAL????

When a gun or a ROMMY G fires and the magazine runs out is it OK for it for the bolt to stay open to load another magazine. Lock open when empty (like a 1911-a 45acp pistol).

Sorry if you guyz allready answered this. I forgot and my saiga has a plate inside the action for this but it does not work yet.

I thought this is a militarty feature which was made illlegal eary in the game. Sporting VS military rifle. The other forum is confused - like me.

Not fire from open bolt - bolt locks open when magazines runs out.

sure, and in fact its standard with many rifles/carbines FAL, VZ 58 just to name a couple, as long as it does not fire from the open bolt ie; interaction between trigger and hold open device

Way super cool!!! I will start working on a mechanism for stay open GIZMO / plate. Do THEY already make one. My siaga - I will take a look and see my it does not work. OH goodie goodie.

yep there is an outfit making them but I don't recall who it is, maybe someone else will remember, I just run BHO mags it doesn't take me much longer to reload an AK than it does a carbine with BHO, the BHO mags are simply to notify an empty chameber

Thanks If it is made why re-invent da wheel. I will look at vendors.

I was thinking of a drop in plate and sring the did not modify rifle.

here it is

http://www.geocities.com/akcatch/

Way super cool!!! I will start working on a mechanism for stay open GIZMO / plate. Do THEY already make one. My siaga - I will take a look and see my it does not work. OH goodie goodie.


translation please

:confused:

So are weapons that fire from the open bolt position (even if they are semi auto), illegal to own without some sort of license? Are they considered NFA weapons?

E-man, open bolt just refers to the bolt not have a locking mechanism to
prevent it from moving from the firing pressure. You do not see blow back
designed guns shooting high pressure rounds as the bolt would have to be
very heavy to contain the pressures. Somebody else will chime in and correct
me here if I'm wrong but this is my understanding. A 9x18mm is about the
largest pistol round that blow backs are built to contain. Now if you are going
to take a big rifle and build a blow back I would think you could go larger as
there is a lot of mass in the bolt and carrier to work with. Now also there are
many retarded blow back or delayed blow back designs that work well and are
not a close bolt system so must be considered open bolt even though they do
not allow the bolt to move immediately or with complete freedom, czs' mp5s'
are some examples.

You misunderstand. I should have been more clear. I know the difference between a gun that fires from the open bolt position, as opposed to a gun that fires from the closed bolt position. I am also aware that as a general rule, open bolt guns shoot pistol cartridges except for the MG42 and a few others. My question is, are semi-auto guns that fire from the open bolt position illegal to possess without a license? Guns that fire from the open bolt position are cheaper to manufacture and far less complicated to produce since the firing pin is fixed. Since I see no semi-auto open bolt guns on the market (doesnt mean they arent out there I just havent seen them) I can only assume that there must be a legal reason. Example, the semi-auto PPSH41's I've seen for sale. Originally open bolt weapons that have been converted to closed bolt. I understand this weapon has to be converted so it can't accept full auto parts, but does this mean NEW manufactured weapons cannot fire from the open bolt position? Sorry for the thread hijack Utga!

The problem with open bolt weapons OF ANY SORT, pistol, rifle, old kit form, new production idea, is that they can be modified to shoot full auto WAY TOO EASY, this is the NO NO in the BATF's eyes.

Hence open bolt with a fixed firing pin is a BIG no no

Are you talking about a bolt with a protrusion like a single action hammer on
a colt? I don't think I am familiar with any guns that have them as the bolt
would have to be held back and slammed home to fire the round. If you have
a link I would like to see a gun that is built that way. as far as semi auto open
bolt guns, how about a ppk, or a makarov .

Are you talking about a bolt with a protrusion like a single action hammer on
a colt? I don't think I am familiar with any guns that have them as the bolt
would have to be held back and slammed home to fire the round. If you have
a link I would like to see a gun that is built that way. as far as semi auto open
bolt guns, how about a ppk, or a makarov . "I don't think I am familiar with any guns that have them as the bolt
would have to be held back and slammed home to fire the round"

Thats pretty much the definition of an open bolt gun. Ever hear of a STEN? How bout a mac 11, mac 10 ect ect ect .

This hole post has gone off topic.

Is he asking about BOLT HOLD OPEN or OPEN BOLT ACTION. Two entirely diferant things.
I beleive he was wondering about bolt hold open, the easiest way to achieve this with an ak is simply to use YUGO mags (or followers)

Yeah knall we know, that question got answered a while ago. And thanks on
the mac 10's etc.. I never knew they built guns that way.

You misunderstand. I should have been more clear. I know the difference between a gun that fires from the open bolt position, as opposed to a gun that fires from the closed bolt position. I am also aware that as a general rule, open bolt guns shoot pistol cartridges except for the MG42 and a few others. My question is, are semi-auto guns that fire from the open bolt position illegal to possess without a license? Guns that fire from the open bolt position are cheaper to manufacture and far less complicated to produce since the firing pin is fixed. Since I see no semi-auto open bolt guns on the market (doesnt mean they arent out there I just havent seen them) I can only assume that there must be a legal reason. Example, the semi-auto PPSH41's I've seen for sale. Originally open bolt weapons that have been converted to closed bolt. I understand this weapon has to be converted so it can't accept full auto parts, but does this mean NEW manufactured weapons cannot fire from the open bolt position? Sorry for the thread hijack Utga!

there was an atf ruling in 1982 that prohibited the manufacture of open bolt magazine fed firearms, as they are easy to convert to select fire, whether fixed firing pin, or not. the best example of an open bolt gun i know of is the old browning machine gun. it has a floating firing pin, etc. the 1919 was designed open bolt, as were most General Purpose Machine Guns (GPMG) and Light Machine Guns (LMG) to prevent cook off after a long string of fire in which the barrel temp has been forced over 500* F. submachine guns were usually designed open bolt in the interest of reliability and cost reduction.

the open bolt guns have a sear engagement that stops the bolt in the open position, and an automatic firing pin release or a fixed firing pin, rather than a sear that allows the bolt to shut, controlling only the hammer or striker that actuates the firing pin.

open bolt non-magazine fed guns, single shots, now that issue is less than clear. they are not specifically addressed in any opinion letter i am aware of, and not easily convertible, so should be legal.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZqBCUB1_O2M

Good info justashooter, thanks.

To expand on that a bit, several open bolt magazine fed semi autos were produced prior to the ATF ruling. The Interdynamics KG99, the RPB MAC10, DEMRO TAC series Carbines, several "tube gun" type "copies" of the Thompson, etc. Most of these are considered "grandfathered" and are legal to sell and own, although you can't make any more. Some (the "Spitfire" comes to mind) were specifically declared machine guns by ATF and are illegal even in original semi auto form unless they were properly papered back in the day.

Some open bolt designs were approved after the Mac 10 ban. These are not semi auto. One is a single shot 12 gauge shotgun. I have an open bolt BAR that has no gas system and it is an approved design.